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Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

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Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#311

Post by j45 »

s73ver_ wrote: post #195
WalterBright wrote: post #155

It's never been easier to get training in all sorts of things, for free. For example, I'm currently taking MIT's 6.002 electronics course because I never learned circuit analysis properly. It's on youtube, it's free, I watch it anytime. There's the Khan Academy, too.

Yeah, but there's no certificate. And, despite what everyone wants to believe, most employers still want that certificate or degree. They're not gonna accept "I watched a bunch of videos on YouTube" as an alternative.

A certificate is one thing.

Expecting your education to make something of you, instead of making something of your education (track record) is another.

Managing to get a certificate does not guarantee one can apply those YouTube videos.

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#312

Post by j45 »

ralmidani wrote: post #281
thatonechad wrote: post #68

Universities need to start focusing on skills instead of general education. Imagine the amount of skills you could learn if you didn't have to take 60 hours of nonsense credits and focus on skills you require. Programming / Networking / Hardware need a new type of University that is similar to Trade colleges but focus primarily on the skills and nothing more. The first 1-2 years could focus on the foundations while t…

I know this is a cliche, but universities (are supposed to) teach you critical thinking as well as social and life skills, not just train you for a specific vocation. Watering down university education is not necessary. If someone wants to focus just on tech skills, they can go to a boot camp. Expanding boot camps so they become multi-year experiences may be a good idea, but they should not be called universities.

I would say few universities teach critical thinking or transferable skills in the context you are referring to.

Some programs in universities can be glorified vocational schools. Other programs are excellent, relevant and evolving both for industry, and as innovators.

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#313

Post by [deleted] »

vilmosi wrote: post #152
briholt wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another major glaring problem that no one wants to admit is that lots of tech work requires (at the very least) college-level-IQ, which excludes the majority of the population. And the lower-IQ jobs are quickly being automated away.

IQ just means potential not capability. Given enought time I believe most people can be trained to do almost any job. I don't think our brain suddenly evolved in 200 years from illiterate peasants to software engineers. We just have more school time these days.

[deleted]

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#314

Post by KC8ZKF »

demygale wrote: post #99
thatonechad wrote: post #68

Universities need to start focusing on skills instead of general education. Imagine the amount of skills you could learn if you didn't have to take 60 hours of nonsense credits and focus on skills you require. Programming / Networking / Hardware need a new type of University that is similar to Trade colleges but focus primarily on the skills and nothing more. The first 1-2 years could focus on the foundations while t…

Name a giant in this industry, that person benefitted from a liberal arts education.

Steve Jobs

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#315

Post by SamReidHughes »

jas_far wrote: post #264
SamReidHughes wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't even teach calculus to some people to the point where they can pass a class. Some people in programming classes can't even submit homework that compiles.

Calculus and programming are in two different leagues of complexity, and most programming doesn't require a knowledge of calculus. Like any other skill, programming comes more easily to some than others, but with the right approach can be acquired by anyone.

Calculus classes are more passable than programming classes, and the claim you're making is just pulled out of your hat, made in such a way that you could never be found wrong, because no matter what you could just say you're not taking the right approach.

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#316

Post by [deleted] »

demygale wrote: post #99
thatonechad wrote: post #68

Universities need to start focusing on skills instead of general education. Imagine the amount of skills you could learn if you didn't have to take 60 hours of nonsense credits and focus on skills you require. Programming / Networking / Hardware need a new type of University that is similar to Trade colleges but focus primarily on the skills and nothing more. The first 1-2 years could focus on the foundations while t…

Name a giant in this industry, that person benefitted from a liberal arts education.

[deleted]

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#317

Post by smileysteve »

s73ver_ wrote: post #227
WalterBright wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Far and away most people are healthy 20-60 and are not sidelined by disastrous health problems. The point is invest early in your working life, and you'll have the needed results when you're ready to retire. $1,000 is not what people would consider "having money" is. $200,000 is. If you have a car, it surely cost far more than $1,000.

A car is a necessity in most of America for getting around. Most people likely do not have a spare $1000 laying around. And knowing what to invest in is another can of worms in itself. And depending on who you're talking to, having a spare $1,000 risk on investment is "having money".

> And knowing what to invest in is another can of worms in itself.

For the record; knowing what to invest in is easy: a broad based low cost index fund. The research in "A Random Walk Down Wallstreet" statistically shows that actively choosing specific companies has a less than 50% success rate and often comes with higher fees. For the record, most public libraries have a copy of "A Random Walk" and its conclusions are well shared.

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#318

Post by synicalx »

baursak wrote: post #269
synicalx wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess other than wanting a continuing supply of in-country tech's to hire (as others have touched on), it sort of comes back to the old "give a man a fish" vs "teach him to fish" shenanigans. They could hire a bunch of janitors, who are already employed anyway, and essentially just transfer that $1b directly into their pockets but at the end of the day they're still going to be janitors. By investing that some amou…

This implies that janitor is an inherently inferior job that deserves lower pay. It might be true, but in my opinion an average janitor is more beneficial to society than an average programmer. More to the point though, what happens when a janitor learns to code and gets a coding job? You still need a janitor!

> More to the point though, what happens when a janitor learns to code and gets a coding job? You still need a janitor!

That is a good point, but I think it comes down to the barrier to entry - it's easier to become a janitor than it is to become a programmer so one could probably assume there's always going to be a steady stream of people who are willing to do janitorial work.

> This implies that janitor is an inherently inferior job that deserves lower pay

It does unfortunately. Given some of the awful stuff janitors have to deal I believe they're deserving of higher pay, but unfortunately the job market doesn't agree with me on that.

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#319

Post by kbart »

s73ver_ wrote: post #195
WalterBright wrote: post #155

It's never been easier to get training in all sorts of things, for free. For example, I'm currently taking MIT's 6.002 electronics course because I never learned circuit analysis properly. It's on youtube, it's free, I watch it anytime. There's the Khan Academy, too.

Yeah, but there's no certificate. And, despite what everyone wants to believe, most employers still want that certificate or degree. They're not gonna accept "I watched a bunch of videos on YouTube" as an alternative.

Usually, as soon as you get through the first interview, your papers won't matter much. Credentials might help to get you that first interview, but getting a good engineering job still requires deep technical skills and that's where those, who "watch a bunch of youtube videos" can shine. I have my credentials written on CV, but never have been asked to show any of these papers or shown any interest in them.

Re: Google commits $1B in grants to train U.S. workers for high-tech jobs

#320

Post by kbart »

thatonechad wrote: post #68

Universities need to start focusing on skills instead of general education. Imagine the amount of skills you could learn if you didn't have to take 60 hours of nonsense credits and focus on skills you require. Programming / Networking / Hardware need a new type of University that is similar to Trade colleges but focus primarily on the skills and nothing more. The first 1-2 years could focus on the foundations while t…

You mean making meat robots that can code? Higher education is supposed to be much more than just acquiring technical skills. If you want purely technical skills, there are plenty of intense courses, workshops etc. available.
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