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iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

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Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#101

Post by Karunamon »

donohoe wrote: post #66
Terretta wrote: post #6

> In an attempt to keep you connected to Apple devices and services, iOS 11 compromises users' security. No. It is in an attempt to resolve the real loss of money experienced by everyday users who turn off WiFi when it’s flakey and then forget to turn it back on, costing them cash on their cellular data plan. (And the very real frustration when things don’t work they expect to work, and they don’t know why.) Meanwhil…

No. It’s not. I want to turn it off. The fact that this is front-page on HN means something.

It means that the minority of techies that read HN found it interesting. There’s nothing to suggest any conclusion broader than that.

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#102

Post by djrogers »

trowawee wrote: post #42

This has been easily the most obnoxious change of iOS 11. It is super annoying to have to dismiss the list of available WiFi networks every single time I open my phone while walking around the city, no matter how many times I turn my WiFi off.

Turn off ‘ask to join networks’ - mine been that ways for 10 years and it’s much better.

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#103

Post by jwong_ »

Nition wrote: post #93
djrogers wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The WiFi radio uses less power than the LTE one, so if you’re in range of WiFi you save battery by leaving it on.

I don't have a data plan so I always have mobile data off.

That doesn't turn off your LTE radio though...

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#104

Post by addicted »

MBCook wrote: post #15
codefined wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This change would be absolutely fine to me if it were communicated to the user in any way whatsoever . The fact that I can upgrade and have no idea the behaviour unless I happen to read an EFF blogpost in the few hours it appears on HN isn't acceptable. Note how they even use privacy as one of the main (at least, in my opinion) selling point for Apple devices[0] ("Every Apple product is designed from the ground up to…

It IS communicated. If you just pull up control center and tap the button is says “Disconnected from ‘WiFiNetwork’”. If you expand the panel with 3D Touch or a long press under the WiFi icon it either says WiFiName or Not Connected. On the other hand the cellular radio says Off if you toggle it. This isn’t completely hidden. The information is there. And I agree with the other posters that this is a far better settin…

So all these years when Apple showed basically the same visual cues triggered by the same action they were miscommunications to us?

You can’t have it both ways. Apple either miscommunicated this ever since Control center was added till today or they are miscommunication pang today.

I would lean in the direction of miscommunicating today because Apple has spent years teaching its customers that this behavior means X and now it’s been changed to Y.

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#105

Post by nkristoffersen »

mattacular wrote: post #32
new299 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just spent a couple of minutes trying to 3D touch to properly disable wifi, then googling how to do this with 3d touch and came up empty. Either it doesn't work that way, or it's well hidden and appears not great in terms of UX. Overall, I agree with you though. I'm personally not clear on the utility of turning off just wifi or just bluetooth. I assume (hope) airplane mode turns everything off. But in any other sc…

There is no way to 3D touch the bluetooth and wireless radios all the way off in iOS11. You have to manually go all the way into settings.app now which takes quite a bit more effort not to mention longer than the old control center

You can 3D Touch the settings app which provides shortcuts to both bluetooth settings and wifi settings.

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#106

Post by spc476 »

getaclue wrote: post #34

Is it to farfetched to say that this may have lead to a decrease in performance and battery life that I've noticed on my iPhone 7 plus? I mean... the phone feels... sluggish now. I don't know how else to say it. Interesting time we live in friends. It seems like you have to observe every application, every update, and monitor everything if you want your software to do what you expect it to do by using it. Passing it…

I'm resigned to the fact that any workflow I have will break with the next update. And if it's a web application, it will break with the next refresh (I'm looking at you, Google Maps!). It's the CADT model [1] writ large.

[1] https://www.jwz.org/doc/cadt.html

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#107

Post by robotresearcher »

nkristoffersen wrote: post #96
egypturnash wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a phone that is 3D Touch capable and I never use 3D Touch at all . In fact I mostly avoid using it; it's Those Useless Options That Sometimes Pop Up If I Press Too hard On A Thing. It's on par with OSX's "some menu items change if you hold down alt while they're open" behavior. Aggressively obscured.

You're missing out. 3D Touch is pretty powerful and provides access to more than "Useless Options" now.

It still bugs me as very undiscoverable. I don’t want to press things I don’t intend to toggle just to see whats underneath them.

Maybe I’ll get used to it but right now I’m old man grumpy.

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#108

Post by jwong_ »

dvcrn wrote: post #23

I hate this. I have a ton of wifi hotspots setup in the city, some of them require authentication, some of them don't. I leave work, mount my phone on my bike, "turn off" WiFi and cycle before realizing that nothing (like maps) is updating because I connected to a wifi point that needs authentication, or a point that is now far away because I already cycled by. While cycling, I reach to my phone and switch it "off" a…

If you want to be off wifi why not just fully turn it off? It seems like you want it to be off for a long time. Going into settings to turn off the radio doesn't seem to be hugely laborious if you really do want it off for the entire ride.

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#109

Post by clouddrover »

colejohnson66 wrote: post #87
clouddrover wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is patronizing and I need no such reminder.

Then stop acting as if your use case is what the majority of users want. If you really care about a toggle that actually turns off the radio, get an Android

Reread what I have written. Your misdirected anger is your problem, not mine.

Re: iOS 11's Misleading "Off-Ish" Setting for Radios Is Bad for User Security

#110

Post by trowawee »

djrogers wrote: post #102
trowawee wrote: post #42

This has been easily the most obnoxious change of iOS 11. It is super annoying to have to dismiss the list of available WiFi networks every single time I open my phone while walking around the city, no matter how many times I turn my WiFi off.

Turn off ‘ask to join networks’ - mine been that ways for 10 years and it’s much better.

I...don't want my phone to automatically connect to random open access points? I live in a city where there are at least 5 separate open networks available at nearly all times if you're just walking around, most of which I do not want to connect to.
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