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China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

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Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#111

Post by rqs »

alistairSH wrote: post #89
rqs wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese here. In China, lot's of people who originally supported 刘晓波[0] shuts up after Obama's winning . So, yes, at least in China, Nobel Peace Prize is nothing now. 0: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liu_Xiaobo

Obama won the year before Liu Xiaobo, so how does this make sense?

Liu Xiaobo always has supporters.

Far as I can remember, at that time (Around 2009, 20 years after Tiananmen event), there are some people says Liu Xiaobo should be awarded with the peace prize for against CCP's dictatorship.

Some people event had a debate about it. Some say Liu is a hero for democratize China, others say he's wants China to be invaded and controlled by ... may be the US?

That debate later end with Obama's prize.

I'm not saying Obama is bad or anything though. It's not appropriate for an outsider to comment your president.

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#112

Post by jonnathanson »

Geekette wrote: post #68
imron wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wow, shocking to read of such deep capitulation from a country like Norway China forces every country that it has normalised relations with to adhere to the 'One China' policy. Does your country have a Chinese embassy in it? Guess what, your country adheres to the 'One China' policy too.

Pretty sure other countries' recognition of (which does not necessarily equate to acceptance or support of) China's position on this do not extend to the level of sovereign embarrassment and capitulation outlined in the post.

As barkingcat suggests, pretty much every country on the planet that has normalized diplomatic relations with China formally accepts the One China policy. This is part of China's chess strategy for forcing the world to accept its ownership of Taiwan.

I will go out on a limb for a second and suggest that the day will come soon enough when the United States formally bends the knee on this issue as well. We are headed in that direction much faster than anyone anticipated.

The 'free world' has chosen to worship the Almighty Dollar as its lord and sovereign. China is where most of your dollars come from now. Ergo, China has the mandate of market-capitalist heaven, and you work for China now.

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#113

Post by KekDemaga »

wallace_f wrote: post #110
KekDemaga wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ignorance is why you are being down voted, the man spent his entire time in office at war if that is deserving of a peace prize I'm not sure what you'd have to do to not deserve one.

The military, Wall Street, healthcare financial services, and government (size, reach of power), win after every single election. I don't think Obama is a particularly good or bad man, I think he's just a good politician who went in there and did "what he was supposed to do." Stupid and evil wars existed before and after him. He didn't do anything to fix it, but he didn't start it either. The President doesn't have a…

>The President doesn't have as much power as we may believe.

With these "wars" in particular he actually does have a great deal of power. They aren't actually wars but "military actions" for the most part. The commander in chief can unilaterally order the armed forced to withdraw if he so wished. Instead Obama ordered drone strike after drone strike, bombing after bombing (so many in fact that there was serious concerns that we would run out of bombs[0]). His merits as a president can be debated, his merits as a peace prize winner cannot. He simply did very little to promote peace and much to prevent it (see Syria).

[0]http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/04/politics/air-force-20000-bombs...

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#114

Post by ausjke »

The reality is, money talks, even war is sometimes caused by economic reasons, if not all the times.

with that being said, the rising power of china, with its sheer size, it can essentially now bend everything to its will, including US who has so much trading deficit these years.

and, more cases like this will be down the road, people will probably have to get used to this new ruler in a few decades, mostly not by war, but by its economic power.

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#115

Post by it_learnses »

ausjke wrote: post #114

The reality is, money talks, even war is sometimes caused by economic reasons, if not all the times. with that being said, the rising power of china, with its sheer size, it can essentially now bend everything to its will, including US who has so much trading deficit these years. and, more cases like this will be down the road, people will probably have to get used to this new ruler in a few decades, mostly not by wa…

Unless we can all unite, and bring China back down to where it belongs.

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#116

Post by ChuckMcM »

whatyoucantsay wrote: post #17

There are two notable points in this piece: 1) China suspended normal diplomatic relations with Norway, tossed out a free trade agreement, largely shut down fishing imports from the country and made it far more difficult for Norwegians to get visas to travel study or work in China. All of this was because of an activist being awarded a Nobel Peace Prize, which is process controlled a foundation, not directly by the N…

And the second is the more interesting point, it is the difference between having the US be the most powerful nation on earth and having China in that role. Look to see more of that happening over the next few years.

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#117

Post by wallace_f »

KekDemaga wrote: post #113
wallace_f wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The military, Wall Street, healthcare financial services, and government (size, reach of power), win after every single election. I don't think Obama is a particularly good or bad man, I think he's just a good politician who went in there and did "what he was supposed to do." Stupid and evil wars existed before and after him. He didn't do anything to fix it, but he didn't start it either. The President doesn't have a…

>The President doesn't have as much power as we may believe. With these "wars" in particular he actually does have a great deal of power. They aren't actually wars but "military actions" for the most part. The commander in chief can unilaterally order the armed forced to withdraw if he so wished. Instead Obama ordered drone strike after drone strike, bombing after bombing (so many in fact that there was serious conce…

I completely agree. But what do you think they would have done to him had he refused to go along with it?

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#118

Post by zokier »

Geekette wrote: post #57

Wow, shocking to read of such deep capitulation from a country like Norway, which positions itself as egalitarian and goes the extra mile in various areas such as excluding certain companies from investment by its global sovereign fund on ethical grounds[1]. This was also chilling to read: "And when the Dalai Lama was invited to Norway in 2014 by the Norwegian Nobel Committee to celebrate his receiving the Nobel Peac…

I don't get why this is such a big deal or "deep capitulation". Its a statement, seems more like net win for Norway, they got concrete economical benefits by trading in some (empty) words.

While the treatment of Dalai Lama was unfortunate, it also happened before this normalization, during a period of appeasement. Now that the relations are bit better again and an agreement has been reached, I would expect (somewhat paradoxically) Norways line against China to harden gradually again.

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#119

Post by imron »

fhood wrote: post #94
mikeash wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's one thing to officially adhere to "One China" and quite another to shun respected people that China doesn't like. Do other countries do that second one? The US seems to have no problem allowing the Dalai Lama to meet the President, for example.

Well, the US can piss off China with relative impunity. We represent 18 percent of their exports, and their currency is pegged to the dollar. Norway is less influential.

Relative, yes, but not total. When the Dalai Lama met with Obama, it was a 'private' visit not an official one and they met in the Map room rather than the Oval Office, which apparently has different diplomatic implications.

Even with all its clout, the US still needs to dance around the issue.

Re: China Forces Norway to Adhere to ‘One China’ Policy

#120

Post by zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC »

rqs wrote: post #111
alistairSH wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obama won the year before Liu Xiaobo, so how does this make sense?

Liu Xiaobo always has supporters. Far as I can remember, at that time (Around 2009, 20 years after Tiananmen event), there are some people says Liu Xiaobo should be awarded with the peace prize for against CCP's dictatorship. Some people event had a debate about it. Some say Liu is a hero for democratize China, others say he's wants China to be invaded and controlled by ... may be the US? That debate later end with O…

> I'm not saying Obama is bad or anything though. It's not appropriate for an outsider to comment your president.

Why not?

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