U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country • Hacker News Board

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#211

Post by HillaryBriss » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:48 PM UTC

snarf21 wrote: post #202

mikk14 wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I share the sentiment, misquoting people who were saying almost the opposite of what you meant is not going to go very far. Franklin wasn't talking at all about what you were thinking he was talking. It was about an argument on taxation. http://www.npr.org/2015/03/02/390245038/ben-franklins-famous...

I agree that this quote may have been misappropriated. However, I think it has taken on new life and new meaning and is cautionary in terms of "be careful what you are giving up...". 9/11 attacks were successful in their goals based on exploiting the FAA guidelines for hijackers, not because we didn't spy on these people. No one imagined them turning a plane into a bomb. I think non one believes that if hijackers tri…

If it were saying simply "be careful" it would be more apt. Franklin's simplistic condemnation allows for no middle ground, no exceptions, no room for complex policy to deal with a complex world.

It's also old-fashioned. It reminds me of something Trump would say.

In a modern democracy everyone deserves safety and security, even people who believe the government ought to be granted additional power to constrain "essential liberty" in certain situations or within certain more expansive limits. They may eventually be proven unwise or evil policy choices, but the people advocating them still deserve safety and security -- precisely because they live in a democracy.

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#212

Post by pilsetnieks » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:49 PM UTC

Zenst wrote: post #81

musha68k wrote: post #9

As much as I’ve always loved to come to the US and as fascinating as some US conferences are (e.g. StrangeLoop might be my personal fav) – no international attendee or speaker can be expected to put up with this ever expanding amount of bullshit anymore. If the science community or “our industry” really want to encourage and unlock the magic of diversity we need new venues for a whole lot of conferences either in Can…

Oh I think you will find the EU is not far behind and in some area's further ahead in this orwellian future. Germany for example on verge of rolling out facial ID recognition and trialing currently: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-germany-security/german-p... This with data retention laws imposed upon ISP's, they already have all your data, so no need to ask.

The EU data retention directive was invalidated last year as overreaching. Several countries still have national laws on their books that require data retention but those won't stand up when challenged.

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#213

Post by criddell » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:49 PM UTC

burkaman wrote: post #186

criddell wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that's all they were doing, there would be no need for a law.

What law are you referring to?

I don't know why you are being downvoted because I think you're right. They filed a proposal to modify some database.

I'm not sure why they don't just apply it across the board to all travelers because it seems like adding conditions just increases complexity with no benefit.

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#214

Post by yalogin » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:49 PM UTC

If the US itself does this, it gives a blank cheque for every other country to do it and in some cases it will be ok for other countries to retaliate. Other countries will go further and ask for passwords by default as well.

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#215

Post by radicaldreamer » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:50 PM UTC

Asking this of naturalized citizens is ridiculous and probably against the 4th Amendment. As a group, you can't discriminate against naturalized citizens and natural born citizens except for the job of the presidency as prescribed in the constitution.

Not that it matters whether it's only people with green cards or work visas or any other category of people required to do this, but I'm hoping some precedents for data privacy at border crossings are set or overturned thanks to this ham-handed approach from the Trump administration.

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#216

Post by coldtea » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:51 PM UTC

spraak wrote: post #103

cr1895 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Maybe 50 should be the upper bound. I'm in my fifties and have never had any sort of social media account. Are you not posting here?

Can you explain how you see Hacker News as social media?

It's a social voting website (not to mention the forum).

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#217

Post by zeep » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:53 PM UTC

drderidder wrote: post #79

Some of the comments seem a little disjointed from the details. According to the article, only information that's publicly available online is collected, and specifically for those immigrating to the US, not tourists, conference attendees, etc. There are likely a lot of reasons for many people not to want to travel to the US, but this would probably be low on the list.

as long as they only collect information that is publicly accessible and associated with your real name (because they probably could de-anonimyse a lot of posts made under pseudonyms/nicknames...)

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#218

Post by coldtea » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:54 PM UTC

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #49

SerLava wrote: post #7

Something to realize here: If you're between 10 and 60 years old, "I don't use social media" will likely not really be an answer at the border. Even a barely-used account will not really be an answer. They're going to be able to say you're probably just hiding your real account. That could factor into denying you entry into a country. If this becomes common with many countries, it could become de facto illegal to kee…

Then this is crap. Yes, I have FB, but I _view_ it maybe once per month. I _post_ far less frequently. Twitter? Sure, I follow my local city tweets so I know about things like power outages and when the trees will be cleared after the hurricane. Some of us just don't need the world to know everything about us all the time. I'm convinced there's two types of people. Those who draw energy from other people and those of…

>I'm convinced there's two types of people. Those who draw energy from other people and those of us who get peopled out after a short time and need to be alone for a while to recharge.

Let's call them introverts and extroverts.

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#219

Post by spoiledtechie » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:55 PM UTC

kelukelugames wrote: post #197

spoiledtechie wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since you weren't actually a citizen entering this country, you don't have the same rights as citizens do. Now you do, since you went through the process, but you certainly didn't before. Secondly, if you had nothing to hide, then whats wrong with sharing? You should separate the difference between citizen and non citizen. We know NOTHING about those people coming from outside the country. Immigrants in the past, did…

I am scared. President Trump's twitter account shows he is petty, vindictive, and thin-skinned. I won't be surprised if immigrants who are critical of him are punished. [1] https://www.engadget.com/2017/09/28/aclu-fight-doj-request-i... PS. Immigrants in the past came to kill all of the locals. ;)

No they didn't. They didn't actively come here to kill the locals. Work on your history. They actively came for gold and a new life. The locals and they didn't get along to be very simple about it. War was waged between the two.

Re: U.S. To Collect Social Media Data on All Immigrants Entering Country

#220

Post by arca_vorago » Fri, Sep 29, 2017, 2:56 PM UTC

23443463453 wrote: post #119

dullgiulio wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By this logic, when this administration starts discriminating people who are into programming ("they cause cyber terrorism," might be the excuse) we shall all "get the fuck off programming"?

I think your logic is flawed, Facebook is nothing more than a self maintained state surveillance dossier that naive fools have been tricked into participating in. As Zuckerberg famously said early on "I can't believe these idiots are giving me all their information" (paraphrased). No dictator or other authoritarian regime of all of history could have even ever dreamed in their wildest state of imagination that people…

Don't forget the CIAs venture capital firm helped many of today's tech giants getnoff the ground, including Facebook. Along with NSLs, upstream node collection, and the history of The Company using famous actors/CEOs, Its worth remebering Facebook, Google, Microsoft, Apple, Amazon, are all much less independent private companies and are much more useful tools for the state.