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How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

harpersbazaar.com

421–430 of 449 posts

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My response, then, is "Oh poor you! You have to call the proletarian house cleaners, rub shoulders with the 'help'! How difficult it must be." Leftist cynicism aside: I'm talking more about the "socks on the floor, chair in the way, keeping the house in order mentally" side of things

As the other commenter said, it has nothing to do with elitism. Research takes time. Calling people takes time. And god forbid you have to call a government or medical entity, you might be on the phone for hours. Do you realize how hard it is to get a straight answer on how much things SHOULD cost with regards to housekeeping, lawn care services, plumbing, tree services, roofing, foundation repair, and the list goes…

That is just called labor, it is work aka life.

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#422

Here's some advice for people of all genders: Learn to make decisions immediately and quickly. By laboring over a decision for hours or days, you can unintentionally turn a trivial task into a heavy one. By making decisions quickly you save yourself all the extra emotional and mental labor. Sure you will make mistakes, especially as you are learning to do this. But you will get better at it with practice. It is a ski…

One of the great tricks to learn when making decisions is that if it's taking too long to choose then the difference between the choices must be small enough to practically not matter. Make a choice, Any choice. Flip a coin if it helps.

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#423
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That resonates with me. But I struggle a lot. I feel like my wife's irrationality on some subjects forces us to both spend some of our very limited time here feeling anxious and negative. It's frustrating and feels very one sided. Why can't she meet me half way and stop being so anxious on half the events? Well.. because irrationality doesn't work that way; I get that. I think that true zen for me is finding a way to…

Conflict in relationship, especially intimate relationships, is rarely about the content. It's typically that the context of the situation brings up an emotion that is taboo / off limits, one that the person has spent a life time avoiding. This avoidance is typically do to previous developmental or shock trauma. You can actually learn to use your conflicts as a psychedelic of sorts to do deep transformational work, i…

despite relationships being the single greatest predictor of health and life satisfaction.

That predictor isn't specifically referring to romantic relationships, but all social relationships.

That means family, friends, love, professional etc. It means that ideally, a person who has more of these things is more likely to be healthy and satisfied.

Having a wife but no friends for example, isn't ideal, and vice versa.

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#424
post #6

I found this comic on the topic also insightful: “You should’ve asked” https://english.emmaclit.com/2017/05/20/you-shouldve-asked/

I have issues with the following line in that comic:

> when a man asks his partner to ask him to do things, He's viewing her as the manager of household chores

I disagree heavily with this comic. There's many reasons why he might've not helped by himself. In fact there's a good chance I would've acted like he had and not because I see females as household managers, but because I've been snapped at plenty of times for helping when it wasn't desired, and not helping when it is desired. Unless I'm a perfect mind reader the only winning move is not to play, so I refuse to play.

If you need my help you can very well ask for it. The only thing she would've needed to do in this comic to defuse in the entire situation is go "hey guy, help?".

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#425
post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who often has anxiety: that anxiety is often irrational. Extrapolating fears rooted in one environment to another in which there is no danger is: 1) very human 2) irrational.

I think my point is: yes, the fear is irrational, but you're not irrational because you have the fear. Or saying it the other way, you can't be just rational and the fear will disappear. So it's quite unempathic to think about someone being irrational because he's anxiously, and you don't have anxiety because you're rational.

You can't immediately make the irrational fears disappear, but you can consciously suppress those fears and grit it out to do what needs to be done, thus achieving most of the same benefits. Do this enough times and the irrational fears will gradually diminish (at least for some people).

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That resonates with me. But I struggle a lot. I feel like my wife's irrationality on some subjects forces us to both spend some of our very limited time here feeling anxious and negative. It's frustrating and feels very one sided. Why can't she meet me half way and stop being so anxious on half the events? Well.. because irrationality doesn't work that way; I get that. I think that true zen for me is finding a way to…

I'm in a similar position. My wife's a planner. She over-thinks alot, creates lists for everthing and needs to discuss details with me/friends/parents which most of the time I deem unnecessary. I realized that I can't change her. There's no single solution, but there are a few things she did, which helped her being more relaxed: Yoga, talk therapy, less coffee/more sleep, taking time outside of family. She also had i…

Be careful with the iron rich foods if you're eating the same meals as your wife. Some research shows a positive correlation between higher iron consumption and heart attacks / strokes.

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you might be missing the point. The gift that she wanted was the house cleaning service. She had already been planning/considering hiring someone anyway. The gift was that she would not have to do the work to find, vet, make the calls, research, arrange payment, schedule, etc. for this task. The gift was supposed to be him taking over that work. > The gift, for me, was not so much in the cleaning itself but t…

I think you missed the point. Yes, she wanted a house cleaning service. But that’s not the gift she wanted. The gift she wanted was for her husband to magically divine that she wanted him to use her emotionally-laden approach (seeking recommendations via social) to solving the problem of hiring the service instead of his pragmatic approach of identifying the cost of the service, which he then used his prior training…

She seems like the sort of person who is very particular about the way things are done, and if you don't do them that way she'll be upset. He probably knew he was setup for failure, since she knows exactly what she wants, but won't tell him. He is definitely too passive, but she has probably inadvertently trained him to not do things without permission, because when he's tried she's been upset because he did something she didn't want. She wants him to take initiative, but he's probably gotten in trouble for initiative in the past.

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#428

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was an unreasonable request to begin with. She wanted two things. She wanted someone else to clean the house. This is fine. It happens all the time. But the second thing was that it still had to be done to her exacting standards. So the request was, in essence, "First, become me. Then do this thing that I want in exactly the way I would do it." Hidden requirements. The husband, not understanding this, went about h…

> "It was an unreasonable request to begin with. She wanted two things. She wanted someone else to clean the house. This is fine. It happens all the time. But the second thing was that it still had to be done to her exacting standards." Nope, you missed the point. The point was the wife wanted a day free from housework, which isn't unreasonable. The husband screwed up because by doing the cleaning instead of hiring s…

She didn't ask for what she really wanted, so she didn't get it. This story is repeated every day, everywhere around the globe. She made a wish, and it was granted by a monkey's paw, or an evil genie, instead of a fairy godmother.

Part of the job that I get paid for is to help people figure out how to say what they want in a way that other people can understand well enough to give that to them. The amount I get paid indicates that this sort of thing may be a somewhat uncommon skill, but also in high demand. You can't really expect that skill to be present in every 2-person relationship.

Cleaning services don't watch your kids. If you want a day off, ask for a day off. But when you take that day off, you can't reasonably expect that everything you normally do will still get done in the way that you do it. The world does not revolve around you, and it takes constant effort to fool yourself into thinking it does.

Micromanagement is bullshit at the office, and it's bullshit at home. If you want relief from the emotional burden of making sure the whole world dances to your tune, you will have to allow someone else to play theirs. You will have to accept that you are the only person that wants exactly what you want, and that sometimes close to that is good enough.

If you cooperate with a person that overextends their will onto the world, you are not really helping them. You are reinforcing their unhealthy behaviors, and allowing them to export their self-torment to you. Some people enjoy that sort of thing, and that's fine. Sadists can pair up with masochists, and make each other happy. It's not my thing, so when people throw that kind of relationship at me, I dodge instead of catching it.

This "emotional labor", as described in the article, is not real work [in my opinion]. It is squirting neurotransmitters into your own brain, that will occupy receptor sites for a time, and then reuptake to be squirted out again later. If your own emotions cause you enough distress to raise your cortisol, medical treatment is available, including therapy by trained professionals that specialize in your exact problem. Would you ask your spouse to set a compound fracture in your leg? Not unless you were on walkabout in some hinterland. Normally, you go to an orthopedic surgeon at a hospital. The same holds true for a broken brain. It is not acceptable to use another person as your brain-crutch for the rest of your lives when genuine treatment is available. And if you value your own life, you will not be that crutch for someone else for any longer than it takes to get them to someone that can actually help them.

Don't allow yourself to be micromanaged (unless you like it).

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My spouse has assumed the responsibility for ensuring that the family has a dinner every evening. I have assumed the responsibility for ensuring that every individual family member is capable of providing their own dinner from available materials every evening, if they choose to eat a dinner. This is "give a man a fish" versus "teach him how to fish". In this, we are at cross-purposes. I can prepare salubrious meals.…

I'm not sure your preference for running the gas tank down to empty before refilling it is more logical than her preference to keep it topped off. It sounds like you each have your preferences, and the tension comes from one (or both?) of you assume that your emotional preference is somehow objectively or factually correct. Maybe if you indulge her on the pantry situation to assist in her happiness, she can indulge s…

It's not even a matter of running it down to empty. It's actually using some fraction of the capacity of the tank built into the vehicle instead of always using a 50gal bypass tank that takes up all the trunk space.

And I never specified whether either of us were male or female. (On the Internet, no one knows if you're a dog.) I'm not going to say whether you assumed correctly with your choice of pronoun.

In our household, my spouse overfills the pantry regardless of my preference. I don't get worked up over it, or keep score. It's just something that happens, and isn't important enough to turn into a point of contention. Each issue exists independently, so it would be unfair argumentation to drag that one into a separate issue to try to score points and "win" instead of addressing the issue itself. So we have a pantry that is difficult to walk through without turning sideways.

I don't worry about it. It's a first world problem. My spouse knows I don't like it, and that's all that needs to be done from my end.

Re: How Emotional Labor is Dragging Down Gender Equality

#430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "I call that "not really caring"." I call it "not really understanding". The cleaning was most likely more work than a few more phone calls to cleaners for quotes would've been. If it was about not caring then why wouldn't the husband put in the minimum effort and get in someone else to do the cleaning?

Because it was expensive and it goes against his pride to pay so much money for something he can do himself. Maybe he cared a lot about his self-image as a self-sufficient most-definitely-not-a-spoiled-rich person.

"He told me the high dollar amount of completing the cleaning services I requested (since I control the budget) and asked incredulously if I still wanted him to book it."

In the article she mentions that she controls the budget, so it was probably over the budget he had to work with.

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