China Blocks WhatsApp • Hacker News Board

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#241

Post by Animats » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:14 PM UTC

HillaryBriss wrote: post #183

Animats wrote: post #123

Naomi Wu's comment on China's surveillance: "That's basically the social contract. Someone grabs your purse, you go to the police station, they show you the video, usually catch them. ... Honestly, I hear more anger on Weibo/Wechat when there's not camera footage of a crime than any unhappiness over cameras on the street etc."[1] [1] https://twitter.com/realsexycyborg?lang=en

the UK does tons of video surveillance of public spaces. much much more than the US, where cameras are often low-res garbage, broken or hacked for use in botnets.

In the UK, if you're robbed can you go to a police station, see the video, and get the cops started on finding the robber?

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#242

Post by Posibyte » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:14 PM UTC

abiox wrote: post #114

rubatuga wrote: post #62

It makes sense, as a country you wouldn’t want US companies taking over your social media. It’s only alarming from a US centric view.

should every country block every other country?

The statement doesn't seem imperative as much as it's just generally relatable. In the end, it comes down to the values and limits of each society as to how they approach and react to something like Facebook and Google's massive influencing powers.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#243

Post by eurticket » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:15 PM UTC

chaostheory wrote: post #40

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

> China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth.

The same thing happens in the U.S on another level. This isn't necessarily a case the choking of the free flow of information and censorship, but I think we've all seen a steady increase in the future being delayed for the now.

Around a month ago, there was an question on HN discussing train automation and why it isn't already done as it seems much easier to automate than other forms of transportation. A first-hand account commented that it was because unions have been fighting to block it to keep their jobs; stalling innovation and future growth.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#244

Post by spullara » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:16 PM UTC

We (the US) have to start treating the blocking of our internet applications as trade embargoes. They are the future of our economy.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#245

Post by ralusek » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:16 PM UTC

School-Cotton wrote: post #210

micaksica wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> their middle class are now sending their children to western schools and many of them will probably go back to China I disagree with the "middle class" being the ones sending their children internationally. The Gini coefficient in China is higher than that of the United States. Even if it was the same income distribution, America's middle class cannot afford to send their children to private schooling in other coun…

"Middle class", "upper class", etc. are not defined by percentiles. Otherwise it would mean nothing when we say a particular country has a "growing middle class".

If they were defined by percentiles (i.e. certain definitions of middle class dictate the middle 60% of the population by income), you could still describe a "growing middle class" as a middle class acquiring a greater percentage of total income. While the population of the middle class isn't growing, its buying power still could be.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#246

Post by smegel » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:17 PM UTC

chaostheory wrote: post #40

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

> What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth.

Yeah blocking a foreign competitor is going to be terrible for innovative Chinese startups.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#247

Post by kuschku » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:18 PM UTC

victornomad wrote: post #29

Last year I went to China, wanted to show a web project I had in internet and it didnt work at all. My hosting was working perfectly and not blocked at all since I could SSH there. Then I realized that I had some jquery loading from a Google CDN and of course the cdn was banned there. And of course CSS fonts from google and youtube videos didnt work either... I learned 2 lessons. 1) dont rely on CDNs if you want to h…

Yup, and this makes it even more problematic that Google is forcing us developers to use their services more and more on Android.

There are users in other countries, users in corporate intranets, users on Amazon Kindle devices, users on open source Android ROMs.

None of these will have access to the required Google services.

But we can’t make apps without them anymore.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#248

Post by nilved » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:19 PM UTC

kinkrtyavimoodh wrote: post #135

victornomad wrote: post #29

Last year I went to China, wanted to show a web project I had in internet and it didnt work at all. My hosting was working perfectly and not blocked at all since I could SSH there. Then I realized that I had some jquery loading from a Google CDN and of course the cdn was banned there. And of course CSS fonts from google and youtube videos didnt work either... I learned 2 lessons. 1) dont rely on CDNs if you want to h…

> dont rely on CDNs if you want to have global access So don't rely on CDNs for their primary purpose?

Yes.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#249

Post by Fluid_Mechanics » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:20 PM UTC

chaostheory wrote: post #40

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

I disagree - I think having some control over the self-destructive urges of a population during times of economic trouble is a positive thing. Several democracies with cancerous social media networks are teetering on the brink of right-wing proto-fascist parties as a result of the recent recession and perceived immigration issues.

The mob needs to be controlled for progress to be protected.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#250

Post by gaius » Mon, Sep 25, 2017, 9:20 PM UTC

Certhas wrote: post #117

chaostheory wrote: post #40

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

Alternative: Innovation happens within the context of Chinas censorship and political regime. Blocking of entrenched western competitors allows home grown solutions to spring up, and local technological know how to develop faster. Capitalism and innovation turn out to work within the context of an illiberal society just fine. Especially as China avoids the mistake of closing itself off to the rest of the world, but s…

China will reach some predetermined level of technology that The Party decides they are comfortable with, then close their borders and just get on with being the Middle Kingdom in splendid isolation. That is my prediction. I don't think they feel the need to project power and remake the world the way the US and previously the UK do/did. Maybe they will disengage from the world and look spacewards.