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Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

washingtonpost.com

141–150 of 171 posts

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It can't logically be the foreign nationals who are attempting to help a campaign. They're not under the jurisdiction of US federal law. Criminal violations of US laws whose prohibition is not expressly territorially restricted that occur outside of the US are successfully prosecuted in US courts with some frequency. Bringing people before the court for prosecution may be challenging where extradition isn't an opti…

In this this hypothetical scenario though it's not even a "person" providing the funds, but a foreign government organization. A US court can't "fine or imprison" the Communist Party of China, or the Russian GRU, for example.

There's always a person making the decision and moving the funds. The Russian GRU isn't a sentient entity by itself. In principle those people can be held legally accountable, although it practice it's probably impossible.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#142
post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it was that New Yorker article that I was remembering. In particular, this bit: > In 1996, during a summit meeting in Moscow, Clinton went for an early-morning run with Talbott in the Sparrow Hills, near Moscow State University. Clinton had known Talbott since they were students at Oxford, and confided his anxiety. He did not regret the expansion of NATO or the decision, at last, to battle Serbian forces in Bosn…

And yet so far Yeltsin is still wrong: Russia's difficulties appear to be permanent. Population and life expectancy have declined. GDP growth has been low and erratic; currently their economy is smaller than Italy. They rank 131st on the worldwide corruption index. All of these problems are self inflicted.

Maybe so. But time will tell.

In any case, it's not the accuracy of the prediction that matters here. It's the motivation.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#143

I implore everyone alarmed by recent Russian assaults on Western Democratic institutions to get their hands on an English translation of 'The Foundations of Geopolitics' by Aleksandr Dugin. Dugin is a Russian academic and the book is essentially a textbook on how Russia should seek to subvert and destabilize Europe, the US and other Russian rivals in order to forge a new empire for the explicit purpose of ethnic Russ…

A lot of Putin's ideas about how to subvert and destabilize western powers have apparently also come from Vladislav Surkov.

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/11/hi...

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#144

I implore everyone alarmed by recent Russian assaults on Western Democratic institutions to get their hands on an English translation of 'The Foundations of Geopolitics' by Aleksandr Dugin. Dugin is a Russian academic and the book is essentially a textbook on how Russia should seek to subvert and destabilize Europe, the US and other Russian rivals in order to forge a new empire for the explicit purpose of ethnic Russ…

That's why it troubles me so much that everyone succumbs to this, like small children. Not just the media that are fueling the divide - but my own friends, making big drama everyday, insulting those with different political views - making the divide even bigger. It really saddens me, especially when I see it among my close ones. It's like mass hysteria, it got completely out of control.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> virtually never mentioned I (anecdotally) hear this tidbit in every comments section relating to Russia's involvement in the U.S. election. Almost as if it's a common talking point. Reminds me a lot of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism EDIT: ... And so a conversation was effectively derailed and nothing was gained. Arguing about the validity of Whataboutism or who is doing it isn't the point. It's a deflec…

OP 'Balance Factor' has only made political comments with their HN account. Repeated discourse with an unstated agenda is an attack vector most of us aren't prepared to defend against.

Political discourse is an "attack vector" now? Dystopian.

This is the kind of delusional thinking that powers most of the American hysteria over Russia. "I can't accept the reality that President Trump appealed to lots of people, so it must be the result of external manipulation of the stupids".

Occam's Razor says: maybe people who post on HN like to keep their political speech separated from their technical speech, the latter which can be done under their real name? That's how I do it. This account posts to technical stories sometimes but mostly to stories on social issues. I have another which is used mostly for technical stories.

The reason is simple enough: just look at the prior story I posted comments on ("At liberal tech companies...").

In the current atmosphere, especially in the west, there is absolute hysteria and a general mental breakdown going on amongst the sort of globalist/elitist population that thinks Trump is the anti-Christ and Brexit is Revelations. This is an atmosphere in which people find some random bot-driven Twitter account that publishes politically conservative stories and label it as a Russian plot on the basis of no evidence whatsoever ... and people start debating "why is Russia doing this?" instead of asking where's the evidence.

It is a witch burning atmosphere. Trump and Brexit didn't happen because of Russia, except maybe in the sense that Hillary Clinton adopting a policy of starting a hot war between America and Russia turned voters away from her and towards the anti-Russia-war Trump. These things happened because of mismanagement and an attitude of "we can't hear you" towards large segments of the population from the sort of people who are attracted to politics.

Now they've been forced to progress from "first they ignore you" and "then they laugh at you", they've moved on to "then they fight you". Their weapon of choice being an attempt at disenfranchisement through claims that anyone who disagrees with their agenda doesn't really disagree. They've just been reprogrammed through Facebook ads bought by those evil Russians. Once you take out the malign mind-control of a shadowy international conspiracy, Clinton would definitely have won!

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#146

I implore everyone alarmed by recent Russian assaults on Western Democratic institutions to get their hands on an English translation of 'The Foundations of Geopolitics' by Aleksandr Dugin. Dugin is a Russian academic and the book is essentially a textbook on how Russia should seek to subvert and destabilize Europe, the US and other Russian rivals in order to forge a new empire for the explicit purpose of ethnic Russ…

Here's Aleksandr Dugin on youtube talking about Trump's election https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEQlNJdR8jo&feature=youtu.be...

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#147

I implore everyone alarmed by recent Russian assaults on Western Democratic institutions to get their hands on an English translation of 'The Foundations of Geopolitics' by Aleksandr Dugin. Dugin is a Russian academic and the book is essentially a textbook on how Russia should seek to subvert and destabilize Europe, the US and other Russian rivals in order to forge a new empire for the explicit purpose of ethnic Russ…

The US "won" the Cold War by bankrupting the former Soviet Union. And then they humiliated its leadership. Putin was Yeltsin's protégé, and watched him dying of alcoholism. He's still angry. And remember, much of his family died in the siege of Leningrad. So, yes. They have a plan.

The Soviets bankrupted themselves by being Soviets.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#148

I implore everyone alarmed by recent Russian assaults on Western Democratic institutions to get their hands on an English translation of 'The Foundations of Geopolitics' by Aleksandr Dugin. Dugin is a Russian academic and the book is essentially a textbook on how Russia should seek to subvert and destabilize Europe, the US and other Russian rivals in order to forge a new empire for the explicit purpose of ethnic Russ…

Calling publishing some ads in Facebook an "assault on Democratic Institutions" is a bit exaggerated.

The Russians have done a lot more than Facebook ads. I'll give you $100k on ads from Russia is not much compared to the ~$800m the Koch's are said to have put up.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understand what is wrong with "whataboutism". When someone pretends that he has a moral highground, it is a reasonable thing to call them out on it. If you dont't want a conversation to be "derailed", stop making unsupported, wrong or dubious assumptions.

Never heard of the term until Trump took office. Whataboutism was okay during President Obama's term. Bush's screwups were often brought up to deflect criticisms lodged against President Obama. edit: meta

Obama didn't do it noticeably, Trump often, hence you hear about it.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#150

As it is rarely mentioned in the US media, I'd just note that the US pretty openly interferes in Russian elections, and has been doing so for a long time. It's curious this is virtually never mentioned amidst all the accusations of Russia involving itself in US elections. There are many tentacles to the US octopus, for starters you can look at an organization created by and funded by the US congress, the soi disant N…

>I'd just note that the US pretty openly interferes in Russian elections Ah yes, the famous counter-point from the Eastern-block. I'd just politely ask, what Russian elections exactly? Is anyone going to claim with a straight face Russia has open and fair democratic elections? I'm the first to laugh at the pointless US 3 letter agencies' misguided operations, but even they are not so naïve as to believe Putin would a…

I think the Russian may consider the elections in Ukraine as one of their elections.
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