161–170 of 287 posts
This is an intentional strategy to increase the 'cost of regulation' so they can lobby against it and go back to accepting shoeboxes of cash through deposit windows.
Or they want to get rid of a business that doesn't borrow money... There is no money in banking services if they can't charge you extravagant fees. It's ironic :)
Slightly Off Topic: The other thing i notice is how we are dependent on "Monthly" services and subscription. iCloud, Photoshop etc. A lot of these could have been a product that you buy it one off.
An aspect of SaaS that needs to be considered.
The horrible thing is that if you do maintain several business accounts and aren't careful about how you handle transfers between them you could be accused of structuring.
Structuring?
For instance, if you know there's a rule that says every transaction over $X must be reported, so you split your $(3X) deposit into three separate deposits of size $X.
I second not dealing with HSBC. They've been fined as mentioned in the article. They've also lost enormous amounts of data through mismanagement and to hackers, so have gone to the other extreme of "safeguarding" their data. I put safeguarding in quotes because a couple years ago I was responsible for the technical aspects of the acquisition of a small fin. book from HSBC. They did a lot of absolute dictation of gove…
Ironically, I know use Bitcoin and Bitcoin-linked debit cards to pay for Github, Amazon and the rest. Much easier than having all these calls from banks, and for less than 2000 €/month, KYC is very relaxed.
what btc-linked debit cards do you use if you don't mind me asking?
Ironically, I know use Bitcoin and Bitcoin-linked debit cards to pay for Github, Amazon and the rest. Much easier than having all these calls from banks, and for less than 2000 €/month, KYC is very relaxed.
Any recommendations on what you use?
I think this is a huge problem and one that is going to continue and get worse. How is it the banks were the ones at fault, but the customers are paying for it. They just hide behind AML / Knowing your customer and say talk to your MP. I was locked out of internet banking for my business account with Lloyds for over 3 months due to a technical fault in the way it was setup. Was paid compensation in the end, but alrea…
> The only way to solve in the short term is to spread the risk across many banks, and never keep your money in one place. This is always good advice, and when you reach the maximum amount for which an account is insured (100K or thereabouts) it is an absolute must. I have my funds spread over five accounts just in case and make sure you note the legal differences between savings accounts and current accounts, the la…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Lawyers typically invoice once per month, by then this should be long over. And if not they're not monsters either, and should given the fact that they know exactly what the state of affairs is be more than happy to wait for a bit. Another reason to cultivate a relationship with a legal office long before you actually need them.
>> by then this should be long over How do you know? This could drag on for months. And in the meantime, your money is frozen by the bank. Not a lot of lawyers will be happy to work for free in the hope you will get access to your money eventually to pay them. And forget about not having money to hire a lawyer. You don't have money to pay salaries (or a salary if you are a one person company), bills, rent, mortgage.…
A couple of lawsuits.
This is a matter of some urgency, a company that has its funds frozen can not trade and the knock-on effects are substantial (employees, taxes, invoices). So the courts should be easily convinced they need to move fast or the damage will be substantial. There are special procedures for such affairs and they tend to be heard within days.
> And in the meantime, your money is frozen by the bank.
That could be a very short time. But then again, I am not a lawyer, merely the frequent consumer of lawyers' time.
> Not a lot of lawyers will be happy to work for free in the hope you will get access to your money eventually to pay them.
Any lawyer unwilling to take your case is not worth doing business with anyway since they tell you effectively they won't be competent enough to see this through to a speedy conclusion.
> And forget about not having money to hire a lawyer.
Yes, I will happily forget about it since it is not an issue.
> You don't have money to pay salaries (or a salary if you are a one person company), bills, rent, mortgage.
This is exactly why you have a case and one with an urgent component.
> You have survival things like paying your rent so you don't end up on the street as top priority while your bank account is frozen.
Well, you will so that's why my suggestion to re-route any outstanding invoices to a new account pronto to avoid getting caught.
> I think you underestimate how expensive lawyers are and especially for small businesses they really can't afford them.
I think you underestimate how many times I've used lawyers in the past and how important it is to know your way around the legal system as an entrepreneur. Sooner or later you will either sue or be sued and if that's your time for learning you are too late.
> Which is why there needs to be strong regulation / legislature to make sure banks cannot just freeze your money because their buggy anti fraud system flags your account for some bogus reason.
Likely this is exactly why the account is frozen in the first place. And which is why you need to play this by the book and without delay.
> At the very least they should be forced to allow you to withdraw some amount of money per month (2-3k) let's say while your account is in review, so you have money to pay your rent/gas/food and other basic cost of living expenses.
I'm pretty sure that is exactly the kind of thing a ruling would aim for, but again, going by my experience the bank will avoid going to court at any cost and will long before that point give you a one time option to withdraw your money and move your business elsewhere. Now what happens after that is an annoying problem to have because it may very well be that the business or one of its partners - and not the account - was flagged.
> Apparently they can just freeze your account and your money is gone perhaps for months. That's frightening.
It never was any different, it's just that with the terror and the drugs laws these things happen more frequently. Also, some businesses are much more liable than others to be used for money laundering / financing of crime / evading embargoes and so on and you really need to think ahead about stuff like this to avoid getting bitten by it.
Again, I'm not a lawyer but I have worked in banking - albeit long ago - and even in those days there were plenty of rules in place and I have used the legal system quite extensively and as far as I can see this case is not special or in any way lost before you've tried to fight.
It will cost some time and some money, the latter you may be able to recover depending on how the judge sees things, the former you will certainly lose. I would be extremely surprised if the bank actually let the case go to court and if they do that's a strong sign there is more to this than the OP is letting on so for now my money is on the bank folding at the first sign of serious opposition.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
So in the UK it's legal for banks to simply shut down your account and steal your money, and you have no recourse? Seems hard to believe. Apparently, from his profile, the guy you responded to is from the Netherlands.
Basically yes - the law changed and the banks are just taking advantage of it. Part of this is that while under investigation they are not allowed to talk to you, and have no motivation to act quickly. I have read in a lot of cases, once they start the process it is very unlikely it will end well. You will, of course, get your money back (assuming you can prove everything they want). They will close your account and…
I wonder what the reasoning behind that is. Surely if I wanted to move my company's banking facilities from one bank to another, I'd need to make sure the new facilities were open and working, run both in parallel for a few weeks while clients paid outstanding invoices and the like, and then close down the old ones once everything was using the updated details? If Metro won't open a new account until you can prove that you've already closed down the old one, how many businesses ever transfer to Metro?!
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Lawyers typically invoice once per month, by then this should be long over. And if not they're not monsters either, and should given the fact that they know exactly what the state of affairs is be more than happy to wait for a bit. Another reason to cultivate a relationship with a legal office long before you actually need them.
>> by then this should be long over How do you know? This could drag on for months. And in the meantime, your money is frozen by the bank. Not a lot of lawyers will be happy to work for free in the hope you will get access to your money eventually to pay them. And forget about not having money to hire a lawyer. You don't have money to pay salaries (or a salary if you are a one person company), bills, rent, mortgage.…