Live data from Hacker News

WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

fastcompany.com

91–100 of 185 posts

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#91

I think they're losing focus. I've started seeing cracks in WhatsApp's UI: - Some times when inserting a single emoji on a single line, in between pressing send and the message being sent, the keyboard flickers. - There seems to be a mysterious space between the Euro symbol and the next character...? That space isn't displayed on the webapp. - I had a third one that I forgot. Also bad decisions: - Logs shouldn't be b…

WhatsApp's UI is a complete mess. Trying to explain it to my mum has been near-impossible.

Starting a new conversation is done with an unlabeled FAB on the main-screen. She had no idea that that was even a button.

Then there's four tabs across the top. One for taking pictures, because the Camera-App and the camera-shortcut in the conversation view apparently weren't enough, one for actual chats, one for setting your status, because that's clearly a similar action to chatting and should therefore be placed in a tab next to it, and one for calls, no idea why that's not just a button in the contacts list.

Then when you go into the conversation view, at the bottom you have a generic attach media icon, a take-picture-and-send-it-shortcut and then separate from that the send-voice-message button, sharing its place with the actual send-message button. That might've been clever design at some point in the past, but now you have those other buttons right next to the send-voice-message button, so it should share the look with those as it does a very similar thing.

Also, the unlabeled movie-camera-icon at the top does not mean sending a video, it means starting a video call. You could sort of guess that by the location of that button, but that's still not just obvious, especially not for my mum.

Where you can however now send videos from, is the Emoji-selector. Or well, it's rather GIFs. Reaction-GIFs, even. Which is why I'm not completely opposed to them having placed it there instead of in the attach-media-dialog, but now you have 9 tabs at the top of the Emoji-selector and three tabs at the bottom (also including the search), as well as a delete-key, which does not behave like a tab. And two of these tabs even share the same icon.

Moving on, when you mark a message for selection, you get 5 icons at the top. Two of those are the exact same arrow-icon just mirrored. One means "Reply", the other means "Forward". Even knowing that there's a difference, I couldn't tell you which one means which without first long-pressing on them, which my mum won't know to do.

Also, one of those 5 icons is a star and when you long-press on it, it literally says "Star". Not "Favourite", not "Remind me", not "Mark as Important". I don't even know what it does myself, so I can't tell you what it should say there.

Some of these problems are hard to avoid or hard to get right, but many of these are there, because they absolutely did not focus on being a chat application and instead had to turn the whole thing into everything and the kitchen sink, and then they're even making the individual features compete for a spot in the directly visible GUI, no matter how much it clutters things up, just because they want people to use them.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#92

Here are some numbers i can't find. The number of users chatting on yahoo, aim, facebook, msn messenger, and all the random others combined when it was a thing not to care which people were using. At my job in 2011, every single member of my team was on using a different client, i was on ubuntu using Empathy. The point is, chat was already resolved, and it didn't require some sort of "quiet room or distraction free o…

Talking with non-technical family members was hard in 2007. Partly this was because the most portable solution was a big chunky laptop and most people didn't even have that. But we can't totally separate the mobile computing devices that have appeared since then from the apps installed on them. I'd love a world where open source protocols and clients dominated, but it wasn't quite the utopia you remember.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#94
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Uber re-privatized the gains by circumventing this ridiculous system, and we're all much better for it. Who are those all? Taxi drivers or the general public? I'd rather have professional, decently paid, taxi drivers instead of amateur hour weekend drivers making minimum wage at the expense of yet another working class job.

Actually in India, I am really grateful for Uber. Previously talking to an auto rikshaw or taxi is pretty painful. They are rude, not reliable, charge a lot if you don't know the city or area. Also atleast from my talking to lot of Uber/Ola drivers is that they are earning a lot compared to their previous taxi service. So to answer your question, both drivers and public.

Earning more isn't very true now though.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#95
post #82

I think they're losing focus. I've started seeing cracks in WhatsApp's UI: - Some times when inserting a single emoji on a single line, in between pressing send and the message being sent, the keyboard flickers. - There seems to be a mysterious space between the Euro symbol and the next character...? That space isn't displayed on the webapp. - I had a third one that I forgot. Also bad decisions: - Logs shouldn't be b…

> Sharing metadata with Facebook will be WhatsApp's undoing, mark my words. It pains me to say this, but almost nobody cares. Many people don't even know that Facebook owns WhatsApp. Most people don't care about how privacy-intrusive Messenger (or whatever Facebook's chat app is called nowadays) is, and WhatsApp is less intrusive than that (at least the data is e2e encrypted). I don't see any undoing in sight, unless…

> I don't see any undoing in sight, unless the competition steps its game up a whole lot.

Due to network effects, competitors can't really have a big impact on reducing WhatsApp usage unless something scandalous and hugely worrisome (to the general public) happens with WhatsApp, which then causes many people to ditch it.

I don't use WhatsApp because it's owned by Facebook. So my following comments here should be taken with a pinch of salt. Telegram, which I do use, has been on a rapid pace of development for at least a few years now. If I had to guess, I'd say that Telegram likely provides a much faster, better and richer experience compared to WhatsApp. Just a few features that come to my mind on Telegram that I like and value - username (no need to reveal one's phone number to others), @replies to tag users, cross platform/OS and cross device sync, great search (global as well as within a conversation), and message editing and deletion after sending. Telegram also has bots, money transfer and other features. I'm aware of the comparative security related weaknesses in Telegram, but other ones (like Signal and Wire, more so Signal) that are better on the security front have a long way to go to catch up with Telegram on reliability, features and UX.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#96
icq, aim, msn messenger, google talk (DOA), skype, wechat. besides widespread business adoption, what's special about this one? it's seamless to uninstall an app and get a new one. why would there be customer loyalty to this business model?

ot, i don't understand why anyone would want to get anywhere near mobile. people are too stupid to use these internet devices in moderation and it will destroy all social cohesion. it's a cash grab to the bottom as it devolves into radical groupthink, a breakdown of dialogue, and mass segregation of populations.

how is arguing about anything and everything productive or useful without domain specific expertise? how is mindlessly consuming hours and hours of infotainment benefiting anyone?

but i can instantly communicate to anyone around the world in a matter of milliseconds! your life is not that interesting, a letter sent by post every other month would probably be more fruitful to developing ideas, advancing discourse and carefully articulating thoughts. it's like correspondence chess vs 1 minute bullet matches. one is excited screaming and shouting, the other is a measured conversation and exchange. pretty sure e-mail hit that sweet spot decades ago, with bulletin boards and irc filling the less personal and more immediate gaps.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#97
post #92

Here are some numbers i can't find. The number of users chatting on yahoo, aim, facebook, msn messenger, and all the random others combined when it was a thing not to care which people were using. At my job in 2011, every single member of my team was on using a different client, i was on ubuntu using Empathy. The point is, chat was already resolved, and it didn't require some sort of "quiet room or distraction free o…

Talking with non-technical family members was hard in 2007. Partly this was because the most portable solution was a big chunky laptop and most people didn't even have that. But we can't totally separate the mobile computing devices that have appeared since then from the apps installed on them. I'd love a world where open source protocols and clients dominated, but it wasn't quite the utopia you remember.

Skype

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#98
post #7

Why do we adhere to the assumption that number of users is the ultimate metric of software success? I would like to hear from devs who aren't interested in expanding for the sake of expanding, who still consider their apps to be very successful.

Software success is different for the medium you are in B2B or B2C and then also the market. Chat market is pretty crowded so you're going for quantity.

If I have a B2B tool and it's fairly niche I might only need 100-200 clients but I charge them more :)

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#99
post #7

Why do we adhere to the assumption that number of users is the ultimate metric of software success? I would like to hear from devs who aren't interested in expanding for the sake of expanding, who still consider their apps to be very successful.

Go to Indie Hackers or Basecamp SVN for such material.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder on How It Reached 1.3B Users Without Losing Its Focus

#100
post #7

Why do we adhere to the assumption that number of users is the ultimate metric of software success? I would like to hear from devs who aren't interested in expanding for the sake of expanding, who still consider their apps to be very successful.

For a messenging app, with classic network effects, it’s a very relevant metric.

With the network effect, if you are above a certain threshold then suddenly everybody will use your app. So the number of users is either low, or it is near the maximum number of users. This means that there is little information in the actual number of users.
Post reply on HN