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Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

arstechnica.com

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Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#61

Post by OtterCoder »

mnm1 wrote: post #50
mambodog wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hold on. I'm not a fan of Communism, but there's a pretty clear difference. The Soviet Union was a particular implementation of Communism which chose killing. Killing is not an inherent requirement to the ideology. Contemporary proponents of Communism or Socialism usually aren't claiming that the Soviet Union's implementation was good. In Neo-Nazism the ideology itself has the elimination of other races as its goal.…

Killing is indeed an inherent requirement of communism. That's the only way to gain and hold such authoritarian power and to subjugate the masses as communism does. There has never been a communist regime that did not kill large numbers of people and that's because this is an inherent quality of communism without which it cannot come to or hold power.

It's an inherent quality of government. Since WWII, the US has killed somewhere around 20 million people during their various adventures around the globe. The Soviet Union killed an equivalent amount, perhaps up to three times as much, but both are staggering, horrifying numbers.

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#62

Post by scott_karana »

weberc2 wrote: post #35
idibidiart wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Ex-Christians _routinely_ complain that youtube censors their videos criticizing Christianity." Has that not happened, too? Just reversing roles for the sake of argument. Curiously wondering...

I would be surprised. Christians don't enjoy the same social protections as Muslims (for better or worse) at least in the US.

Other than having their holidays enshrined federally, their words in official documents and anthems, and holding widespread majority not only in the general populace, but particularly among presidents and legislators?

Could you imagine the backlash if a country singer invoked Allah instead of Jesus? And yet, the reverse happens frequently without anyone blinking.

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#63

Post by ekiru »

eighthnate wrote: post #42
Iv wrote: post #9

I say yes. Because you probably disagree with what most people will call hate speech. Criticism of religion, criticism of some historical events, is considered by some as hate speech. Ex-muslims routinely complain that youtube censors their videos criticizing islam. Videos of brutality (that often contains legal proofs of crimes) are removed if they are used by some hate groups, even if the intent of the recorder was…

This is what the "left/alt-left/whatever you want to call them" don't understand. You may initially benefit from censorship because you are the initiators and the one's with the pull, but sooner or later, everyone else will start organizing. When mormons/christian groups/conservatives/etc organize and start flagging atheist/lgbt youtubers/content and getting them taken down, are you going to celebrate censorship? The…

> When mormons/christian groups/conservatives/etc organize and start flagging atheist/lgbt youtubers/content and getting them taken down, are you going to celebrate censorship?

Given that this has happened repeatedly before, I think the response will continue to be the same when it next happens: mostly challenging the choice to censor those materials, not the choice to censor anything. In the case of, for example, Facebook or Twitter this is already apparently the case (in Twitter's case mostly using their more subtle moderation mechanisms), so yes, the stance of queer leftists who support harsher treatment of racism and such online tends to be based in a belief that being queer can in fact be treated differently in online spaces than, for example, advocating murdering black people. After all, if the status quo of online moderation is already harsher against us, that's clear evidence that it's possible for it to be differently harsh between us and neo-Nazis.

[Edited to correct a typo of "mechanism" in place of "mechanisms".]

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#64

Post by Grue3 »

mambodog wrote: post #19
cgb223 wrote: post #12

One of the things that bothers me about recent censorship on hate speech is how selective, and how inconsistently it's applied, if it is to be applied at all. My grandfather escaped the Soviet Union. Stalin's regime killed all of his siblings. All of them. But yet when I check YouTube, Twitter, and so on I see lots of videos professing communisms values. Hell I've seen a pro-communist march in a city I recently moved…

Hold on. I'm not a fan of Communism, but there's a pretty clear difference. The Soviet Union was a particular implementation of Communism which chose killing. Killing is not an inherent requirement to the ideology. Contemporary proponents of Communism or Socialism usually aren't claiming that the Soviet Union's implementation was good. In Neo-Nazism the ideology itself has the elimination of other races as its goal.…

Why is it then, then when you see an outspoken communist on the Internet they freely use Soviet symbolism like hammer and sickle. I take that as an affirmation of the fact that these people don't really think that Soviet Union was a bad implementation of communism. Like, there exist far-righters who avoid using swastika because they don't want to be associated with Nazi Germany. Why do most communists want to be associated with Soviet Union specifically by adopting its symbolism?

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#65

Post by RickJWag »

Yet another left-leaning article working to demonize freedom of expression.

Note there is no condemnation of antifa or BLM-- two organizations prone to violence, intimidation and destruction.

The left must stop their downward spiral and restore a decent balance to politics. Help right the ship, please.

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#66

Post by gscott »

codedokode wrote: post #53
gscott wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the United States most people did not come here already rich and they had to trade among each other to survive. Everywhere communism touches has problems. In Britain check peoples teeth they are a nice color yellow, in Canada you can wait for months for medical care, in Russia you need to bribe the doctor to get medical care, in Venezuela you need to travel to a neighboring country to get food, in Cuba you earn $2…

Your information about Russia might be a bit outdated, there are commercial dental clinics and in public hospitals you can pay for priority reception.

It was Ukraine I was thinking of, you are right.

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#67

Post by rhapsodic »

scott_karana wrote: post #62
weberc2 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be surprised. Christians don't enjoy the same social protections as Muslims (for better or worse) at least in the US.

Other than having their holidays enshrined federally, their words in official documents and anthems, and holding widespread majority not only in the general populace, but particularly among presidents and legislators? Could you imagine the backlash if a country singer invoked Allah instead of Jesus? And yet, the reverse happens frequently without anyone blinking.

>Other than having their holidays enshrined federally, their words in official documents and anthems, and holding widespread majority not only in the general populace, but particularly among presidents and legislators?

You have a point, but I don't think those were the "social" protections the GP was referring to. The left in the US has scorned and ridiculed and actively sought to inflict pain on Christians and Christianity for decades. (Google "Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence" and "Memories Pizza" for examples.) The left would never engage in similar actions against Islam or Muslims.

Edit - hey downvoters, if you find my logic flawed, how about a few words as to why?

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#68

Post by amatwl »

mambodog wrote: post #19
cgb223 wrote: post #12

One of the things that bothers me about recent censorship on hate speech is how selective, and how inconsistently it's applied, if it is to be applied at all. My grandfather escaped the Soviet Union. Stalin's regime killed all of his siblings. All of them. But yet when I check YouTube, Twitter, and so on I see lots of videos professing communisms values. Hell I've seen a pro-communist march in a city I recently moved…

Hold on. I'm not a fan of Communism, but there's a pretty clear difference. The Soviet Union was a particular implementation of Communism which chose killing. Killing is not an inherent requirement to the ideology. Contemporary proponents of Communism or Socialism usually aren't claiming that the Soviet Union's implementation was good. In Neo-Nazism the ideology itself has the elimination of other races as its goal.…

Ah yes. The ol' "Communism has never been implemented right" argument... Oh please.

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#69

Post by weberc2 »

scott_karana wrote: post #62
weberc2 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be surprised. Christians don't enjoy the same social protections as Muslims (for better or worse) at least in the US.

Other than having their holidays enshrined federally, their words in official documents and anthems, and holding widespread majority not only in the general populace, but particularly among presidents and legislators? Could you imagine the backlash if a country singer invoked Allah instead of Jesus? And yet, the reverse happens frequently without anyone blinking.

I didn't say Christians are without social benefits, only that they don't have the same social protections that Muslims enjoy, specifically criticism of Christians or Christianity would never be considered hate speech.

Re: Tech companies declare war on hate speech and conservatives are worried

#70

Post by scott_karana »

rhapsodic wrote: post #67
scott_karana wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other than having their holidays enshrined federally, their words in official documents and anthems, and holding widespread majority not only in the general populace, but particularly among presidents and legislators? Could you imagine the backlash if a country singer invoked Allah instead of Jesus? And yet, the reverse happens frequently without anyone blinking.

>Other than having their holidays enshrined federally, their words in official documents and anthems, and holding widespread majority not only in the general populace, but particularly among presidents and legislators? You have a point, but I don't think those were the "social" protections the GP was referring to. The left in the US has scorned and ridiculed and actively sought to inflict pain on Christians and Chris…

I sympathize (and upvoted).

Currently, "punching up" is seen as more acceptable than "punching down". Whether that's fair is probably a debate worth having, eventually. But there is that significant difference to consider.

Worth noting, of course, that (minority?) Christians also regularly scorn: examples include athiests, evolutionists, women getting abortions, and birth control, and there's a closely related Venn diagram of correlated subjects like climate change, morality-based laws, tradition-based racism, and the like.

This behaviour is not exclusive to the left.

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