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Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

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Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#61

Post by xorblurb »

jhall1468 wrote: post #56
xorblurb wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN turns rabid, rightfully so. Even with so-called good motives, which are not even proven. And to be clear, in no way there can be a good motive here: their pledge is limited to Free and Open Source Software, its not even sure this pledge is binding, and EVEN if they really do limit their use of this patent (would have it been misattributed to Google by error), I don't think they would EVER pay the real inventor the…

Their history dictates their motives, and having never offensively used a patent as of the moment they clearly have good motives. You are attacking the player, not the game. Software patents shouldn't exist. But in reality they do, and as of this moment I would much rather Google own the patent than a troll.

I will never ever buy the "we are forced to do evil things for the greater good" argument.

Especially behind real inventors' back.

You can't just dictate your own distorted ethical vision just because you are too big.

Edit: plus I don't even give a shit if they limit their use of this patent to defend themselves against competitor claims. Clearly even in this limited case this patent still would have (a very good) value, so at least propose the REAL inventor to patent it and sell ultra limited right for that purpose for a few millions. Then this would be kind of ethical.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#62

Post by Sylphine »

jhall1468 wrote: post #57
Sylphine wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Google has to do this to prevent trolls from doing it. So you believe that a company as powerful as Google deserves more consolidated power. No, thanks.I will stick with the possibility of getting sued by a troll than handing that power to Google.

No, but they've never used that power whereas trolls always use it for bad. The fact that you'd rather have a troll own it than Google is literally retarded. That's like advocating you'd prefer North Korea have nukes than the US, because the US already has too much power. Why would you rather be sued in real life over a theoretical fear? Is absurd.

>theoretical fear Profit is always the bottom line. Google isn't some humanitarian project. Get your head out of the clouds.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#63

Post by cma »

justonepost wrote: post #25
cma wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Applying it to video is one of the most obvious applications and it pretty much just slots in as a module, replacing huffman coding or arithmetic coding.

Yeah, that's always tricky, but you are still missing the point. It's not using it for video they have to prove is non obvious but how they are using it for video. Given the elite mathematical skills you'll need to understand all of this I suspect they'll be able to protect it. Good reference on this patent: https://encode.ru/threads/2648-Published-rANS-patent-by-Stor...

https://www.google.com/patents/US20170164007

Claim one: none of the transform block stuff etc. is new. The only thing added is:

> processing a binary flag or bit using the Boolean ANS decoder to generate an output value for the binary flag or bit using the ANS state; and

>processing a token using the symbol ANS decoder to generate an output value for the token using the ANS state;

That's just slotting existing ANS implementation as a module. Other entropy encoders were used in that exact stage prior to this.

The other claims 2-8 just add on ANS optimizations that aren't video specific whatsoever. Things including using a bytestream instead of a bitstream.

If any of those were a significant invention by the filee (I'm not going to rule that out, someone please chime in if there was one), why didn't they also patent their application to the entropy encoding stage of image encoding? Or the entropy encoding stage of all sorts of other compression applications?

I haven't read through all the others below claim 8, they look similar with the main variation being using instructions stored in "non-transitory memory" (hardware decoders), but there might be something more video-specific there.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#64

Post by krzyk »

mirekrusin wrote: post #58

Why this news, posted 2 hours ago, slided from front page to 40th position in about 2 minutes? It's got 251 points, 52 comments which is way more than anything on the front page?

Same here, I saw it at the top, after I read the comments and refreshed the main page, it was gone I found it on the 46th spot.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#65

Post by Nomentatus »

CalChris wrote: post #6

I'm not understanding how Google and employees is claiming to be the original inventor here. Each inventor must sign an oath or declaration that includes certain statements required by law and the USPTO rules, including the statement that he or she believes himself or herself to be the original inventor or an original joint inventor of a claimed invention in the application and the statement that the application was…

The system has changed - it's first to the patent office, now, and vast amounts of intellectual property is being legally stolen.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#66

Post by Nomentatus »

Nomentatus wrote: post #65
CalChris wrote: post #6

I'm not understanding how Google and employees is claiming to be the original inventor here. Each inventor must sign an oath or declaration that includes certain statements required by law and the USPTO rules, including the statement that he or she believes himself or herself to be the original inventor or an original joint inventor of a claimed invention in the application and the statement that the application was…

The system has changed - it's first to the patent office, now, and vast amounts of intellectual property is being legally stolen.

Publication doesn't help unless it's highly publicized, either. Theft is genius now.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#67

Post by cma »

justonepost wrote: post #15
mirimir wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that relevant to an attempt to patent something that's in the public record?

Well, the us has moved to first to file. It could be they are just protecting it from being patented by someone else. Also, until you see the patent app, you don't really know what they are patenting exactly.

Filings under first to file is still subject prior art from any existing patent or publication. The only publication that won't count as existing prior art is a publication from the inventor his or herself under a one year grace period.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#68

Post by cma »

TD-Linux wrote: post #51
cma wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Applying it to video is one of the most obvious applications and it pretty much just slots in as a module, replacing huffman coding or arithmetic coding.

The patent describes not just "slotting in", but one way in particular. Note that if you were to "slot in" ANS into the current AV1 codebase, for example, it wouldn't actually read on this patent because AV1 codes its coefficients differently.

I didn't say it covered slotting it in to anything. I don't read your comment as showing how it is slotted in one "way" in particular, but rather how it is slotted into one thing in particular.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#69

Post by gaius »

Sylphine wrote: post #60
gaius wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It needs to be broken up like https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakup_of_the_Bell_System

More than 90 % of its revenue comes from ads so I don't see a way they would be affected. The only valuable brands are Youtube and the search engine(android could even operate as a nonprofit funded by Google). Progress but hardly a "win".

Make it spin off YouTube, Maps/Earth, Translate, its public cloud, GMail etc etc.

Re: Poland's oldest university denies Google's right to patent Polish coding concept

#70

Post by jacquesm »

agsamek wrote: post #59

This post had 251 points in two hours. It was no 1 post for some time and now it was downgraded to 42ND position in the list. 2 hours after posting with 251points. How is it possible????

Google employees flagging it en masse.
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