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A big, successful trial of probiotics

theatlantic.com

21–30 of 70 posts

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#21
post #3

Here's the nature article (paywall): http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/natu... "The special mixture included a probiotic called Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC-202195 combined with fructo-oligosaccharide (FOS), an oral synbiotic preparation developed by Dr. Panigrahi." (from https://medicalxpress.com/news/2017-08-probiotics-sepsis-inf... ) Decrease in other infections (respiratory and nasal) is par…

Not a GI specialist here, but I've read plenty of randomized controlled trials. The one-liner here might be "high quality[1] study shows substantial reduction in infant infections in rural India[2]." The biological mechanism makes sense, and as discussed in the article could be more than just good bacteria fighting off bad bacteria. A cynic may say the immunomodulation stuff is kind of hand-wavy and not being a GI specialist, pediatrician or immunologist myself I don't know. That would be an important point because all infections were reduced (not just GI infections), which may point to confounding variables. More on that later.

[2] As far as how the study applies to most of Europe and the US where infant mortality is 10x less, hard to say. The number of infants needed to treat to prevent a single infection was 27 which is low assuming these drugs are cheap and without side effects. Immediate side effects are unlikely given the low and comparable drop out rates among control and treatment groups. However, long-term effects are unknown given the timeframe of the study. Forming a recommendation for countries with more rigorous pasteurization/food preparation/etc, perhaps more access to care and well-child checkups, and much lower infant mortality in general isn't particularly easy here. I'm not up to date on other studies with probiotics. Again, not my specialty.

[1] The study quality looks sound and exclusions were reasonable, the control (placebo) and treatment groups matched up well in many ways and were sizable. There wasn't very much in the way of dropouts. The study looked at too small a population to determine differences in infant deaths, if there is one at all.

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#22
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When my son was born I did a bunch is research on probiotics with good scientific evidence of efficacy. I ended up getting him these which contain most of the promising/researched strains. It's also a liquid which helps in giving it to a baby. I'm pretty convinced that a good probiotic and Onega3 supliment are extremely beneficial. https://www.amazon.com/BIOAMICUS-COMPLETE-Toddler-Probiotic-...

I would have a hard time trusting amazon to sell the actual product here and not a knock off.

Good point. And certainly not trying to plug amazon, I think the product is available direct from the manufacturer for about the same price.

Probiotics are in general a bit iffy in terms of knowing what you are getting. Also makes a huge difference what kind of heat history it has seen in terms of actual live cell counts (i.e. Sitting in warehouse or hot UPS truck, etc)

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may be that because of diet or other factors, this just wouldn't be as useful in the US.

No, it suggests something in the US is vastly more effective in preventing sepsis than this probiotic concoction.

Access to clean water...

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#24

All the products containing Lactobacillus plantarum may see a boost in sales.

are there any though? From the article, it seems that they had to cultivate the colonies themselves.

VSL#3 has them (amongst others). Not sure whether it's the "ATCC strain 202195", though.

https://vsl3.com/about-vsl/

    Streptococcus thermophilus
    Bifidobacterium breve
    Bifidobacterium longum
    Bifidobacterium infantis
    Lactobacillus acidophilus
    Lactobacillus plantarum
    Lactobacillus paracasei
    Lactobacillus delbrueckii subsp. bulgaricus

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#25
post #3

Here's the nature article (paywall): http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/natu... "The special mixture included a probiotic called Lactobacillus plantarum ATCC-202195 combined with fructo-oligosaccharide (FOS), an oral synbiotic preparation developed by Dr. Panigrahi." (from https://medicalxpress.com/news/2017-08-probiotics-sepsis-inf... ) Decrease in other infections (respiratory and nasal) is par…

Pediatric MD PhD. These are exciting results.

Sepsis among neonates is a major concern, even in the developed world. Babies new to the world have very weak immune systems, particularly with regard to antibody response which is initially almost entirely composed of waning amounts of transplacental IgA. This paper points out the the developing world has even higher rates of infant mortality from bacterial sepsis. So this is a big problem and impactful solutions have been tough to come by.

This is a large double-blind placebo controlled trial. They gave eligible babies 7 consecutive daily doses of either placebo or the study agent. Table 1 shows that both study groups are very similar, so we should not be too concerned with confounding variables. Table 2 shows the striking data re: sepsis death rates, with this "synbiotic" (probiotic bacteria + bacterial food) reducing death from sepsis by almost half(!). Table 3 looks at all causes of death and importantly, significant differences in other causes of death were not observed between the two groups--it wouldn't be all that helpful if this synbiotic group seemed to get some other serious problem as a side effect. It is a pretty straight-forward study and no major flaws in their methods or conclusions jump out at me.

While exciting overall, the authors point out some important points at the end. I think the most interesting is that they used this particular species of lactobacillus after studying babies in India about 20 years ago and finding differences in the rates of colonization with this and other probiotic species. In other words, they didn't just throw any sort of "good bacteria" at these babies--they had strong evidence to show that it actually colonized them and therefore could , in theory, have an effect on rates of sepsis. If they had used lactobacillus GG (one of the other species that they found had low rates of colonization), it would stand to reason that they wouldn't have gotten such an impressive effect or maybe none at all. Then the media would say, "probiotics don't save babies from sepsis." Basically I'm just applauding their careful selection of this bacterial species.

One final important note is that this result should not be generalized to other populations without future studies showing similar effects. The gut microbiome is influenced by geography and other environmental factors and interacts heavily with out immune systems, large parts of which vary by genetic background. To put it another way, just because this bacterial species works well in rural India does not mean it will work well in Peru or anywhere else.

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#26
I find the word probiotic to be inherently problematic. It includes any and all microorganisms that have a single positive health benefit, whether or not they're detrimental in other regards. That if a bacteria were to penerate gut epithelium (very bad), it would still be a probiotic if it reduced constupation.

Even if the research supporting the health benefits of a supplemental bacteria is sound, a single study always has a restricted scope.

It's saddening that 'probiotics' have found their way to products such as baby formula, while there is pretty much no regulation governing their sales and use (at least in Europe).

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#27
post #26

I find the word probiotic to be inherently problematic. It includes any and all microorganisms that have a single positive health benefit, whether or not they're detrimental in other regards. That if a bacteria were to penerate gut epithelium (very bad), it would still be a probiotic if it reduced constupation. Even if the research supporting the health benefits of a supplemental bacteria is sound, a single study alw…

[deleted]

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#28
If you want to try L. Plantarum yourself, get the strain 299v if you can. There's one by Jarrow (not affiliated, just made good experiences with it). AFAIK, most other strains of L. Plantarum produce D-lactic acid, while 299v produces L-lactic acid (I've even seen a paper where they used 299v to treat acidosis). D-lactic acid can be hard to metabolize and can lead to acidosis. Probiotics-induced acidosis is a thing - not good, most people with this end up in hospital and need infusions and some kind of intervention for the long term.

Acidophilus generally produces D-lactic acid, while e.g. L casei shirota (Yakult) does not. It pays to take a hard look at the strains in a probiotic.

Re: A big, successful trial of probiotics

#30
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This strain is in milk kefir, no? Easy to cultivate at home. See also: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-38800977 Water kefir is also available :)

Anecdotal: I recently started taking Milk Kefir and it has been a life changer. I never thought I had any problems till they were resolved by Kefir. Seen great improvements in energy levels and anxiety. It even fixed the minor IBS I had.

Can you please give some details on how you take it?
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