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Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

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Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#211

Post by danielvf »

slackingoff2017 wrote: post #174
stephenbez wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume you meant the top 10%. In the US 56% of people will spend a year or more in the top 10%. 12% of people will spend a year or more in the top 1%. http://www.aei.org/publication/evidence-shows-significant-in...

I had no idea that 12% of the population makes top one percent income for at least a year of their life. What causes so many of these people to fail? How could there possibly be so many jobs that offer that kind of income. Or maybe it's that most jobs offering high income have short tenure..

The 1% for the most part aren't billionaires. Last year in the US, the threshold was just under $285,000. Ignoring professionals, plenty of small business owners can hit that on a lucky year. (And get hammered other years). There are a lot of jobs in the US with companies with fewer than 50 people.

Confiscating the assets of the 1% to create economic prosperity has been tried a few times before, and usually turns out horribly in ten years. You've removed the people who risk their own money from society, and replaced it with only assest allocation by bureaucrats.

Plus, as soon as you removed the one percent, then you have a new one percent.

See Dekulakization https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dekulakization

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#212

Post by imtringued »

bmwe30is wrote: post #30

>Some are rooted, embedded in their communities; and some are trapped — because housing is unaffordable where the better paying jobs are. And the jobs that are high paying are not the jobs they built their lives on. There's some texture and nuance to this statement. I remember on NPR, they interviewed a lady whom mentioned similar sentiments; her and her husband had built a family, worked in the blue-collar industry…

Mostly because rich parts of the US like the sillicon valley don't want these people to move there. The zoning regulations prevent building more housing. Rent control is a subsidy for long term tenants against newcomers. (Rent controlled apartment goes for $1500 but should actually go for $2000, land lord sells second apartment for $2500 to cover losses)

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#213

Post by pjscott »

morgante wrote: post #180
TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just the top X%, but the top X% living within commuting distance. There may be some interest in relocating specific highly desirable individuals, but they will already be industry insiders. Industry outsiders will not get relocation benefits. The problem is that jobs have been offshored to increase profits. You really have to think about this to understand it. The Harvard Business Economy has made it impossible f…

> There may be some interest in relocating specific highly desirable individuals, but they will already be industry insiders. That is not in any way my experience. For most companies willing to do relocation (including almost any good tech company), the interview bar is the same regardless of your current location. If they decide to hire you, they'll pay for your relation—especially since it's a blip compared to your…

That has been my experience too. There's a discontinuity along national borders, since green cards are a huge pain the in the regulatory ass, but when I've been interviewing for major tech companies nobody has mentioned within-US relocation expenses. They're too small to bother with, a few thousand bucks at most. Basically peanuts.

(Full disclosure: I went to college in a place so boring that you had to go by the cows and the horses to get to class. I got hired to an unrealistically amazing job via Skype. There was no in-between. It was a big surprise.)

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#214

Post by karmelapple »

bartread wrote: post #141
nostrademons wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I don't understand is why people don't use the time they have in the low cost-of-living area to develop the skills (via the Internet) that would make them attractive to employers in big cities? That was my approach - I lived at home with my parents after graduation, basically did nothing but program (both for work and after work), and after 3 years Google came knocking and paid for my move out to Silicon Valley.…

"That was my approach - I lived at home with my parents after graduation" There's your answer: not everyone can, or wants, to do that. People have families, kids, second jobs already (to pay the bills they need to pay right now, or else bad consequences ), maybe don't get on with their parents that well, or have absent parents, and are generally time poor. Google doesn't come calling for everyone: not everyone has th…

Working on skills when young, or in off hours after a job, is a way to get better and land a job outside of whatever you're currently doing. Not saying it's easy by any means, though - and in some cases is quite near impossible if you must work two jobs just to keep the lights on.

I hope remote working spreads the well-paying jobs around more, so people in low-opportunity places no longer are limited to those few opportunities. They can bring in money from other places to their local community and help economic activity, even f it's simply having enough money to eat out more, go to the community theater, etc.

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#215

Post by karmelapple »

jboggan wrote: post #197
nostrademons wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I don't understand is why people don't use the time they have in the low cost-of-living area to develop the skills (via the Internet) that would make them attractive to employers in big cities? That was my approach - I lived at home with my parents after graduation, basically did nothing but program (both for work and after work), and after 3 years Google came knocking and paid for my move out to Silicon Valley.…

A lot of survivor bias among you and your friend group I would think. I did code in all my free time back in Georgia but I had no CS degree and I had never held a programming job. There were a lot of things that I didn't know I didn't know, as I soon learned when I showed up in SF. I have a lot of friends and contacts back in the Atlanta area that are doing just what you described . . . and they will continue doing j…

If you are a skilled lathe operator, but the only jobs near where you want to / need to live are coding jobs... yes, learn to program.

Just like if you were a blacksmith but nobody was riding horses much anymore, it's time to learn a new craft. It's not easy, but it's necessary.

Having programs to help with that is something that, I think, government can help out with some, especially if government policies are moving the jobs away from lathe operators/blacksmithers.

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#216

Post by paulddraper »

jakobegger wrote: post #147
wott wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No matter how big money people make and how comfortable their way of life is, they always think themselves as lower-middle-class and claim they are on the verge of financial difficulties.

Do they? I feel like I can afford whatever I want, and I don’t think I make more money than most people on HN.

Do you have a house? A boat? Recreational vehicle? A private plane?

Maybe your wants are modest :)

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#217

Post by rayiner »

unknown_apostle wrote: post #60

Working class people are being subjected to ultra efficient hypercapitalism, as in Uber drivers discovering they worked for free when they need to purchase a new car. Meanwhile Wall Street has been bailed out 2 times in the last 15 years alone with monetary policy. How many people went to jail? (And they haven’t learned a thing, on the contrary and quite spectacularly so.) If you want to know where the tech bubble co…

It's interesting that you identify ultra efficient hyper capitalism as the problem, then point the finger at Wall Street traders betting on mortgage backed securities. They really have nothing to do with each other.

To the extent you can blame anyone for ultra efficient hyper capitalism, blame programmers. It's programmers that allowed Uber to turn the inefficient and leisurely taxi industry into the Uber/Lyft rat race. It's programmers who develop the on-demand work scheduling algorithms at places like Wal-Mart. Programmers are the reason why Amazon can take over all the mom & pop stores, turning warehouse workers into appendages of machines. Programmers are the ones who enable international mega-corps to enjoy unlimited economies of scale.

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#218

Post by rytill »

nandorsky wrote: post #121
darod wrote: post #43

I wonder how long it will take for this thought to fade from Steve's mind once he returns to SV. It's easy for people come to these realizations after getting outside of their comfort zone but just as easily return to the status quo. I think one of the biggest myths about tech in general is that it's here to help people. It's really not. It's job is to remove barriers to make workflows more efficient, typically to th…

"I think one of the biggest myths about tech in general is that it's here to help people." It does... if it didn't, it wouldn't exist. Tech is a net positive for society. You typed that on a machine that gives you access to the world's information in seconds at minimal cost. Efficiencies drive down costs which benefits society as a whole. Can you imagine how much your computer/phone would cost if the production of it…

It's not as simple as that it's here because it 'helps' people. It's inevitable that tech comes about - it is possible and if you don't use it you are behind.

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#219

Post by mcguire »

nostrademons wrote: post #106
R_haterade wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The common theme in dystopic stories is the protagonist's unraveling unawareness of just how bad things are. Enjoy!

The irony is that many classic dystopian stories are actually written about today , the time and place where they were written, and not about some hypothetical future. 1984 was based on Orwell's experiences as a propaganda writer for Britain in WW2. Animal Farm was about the Soviet Union. Fahrenheit 451 was inspired by McCarthyism. Saruman's orcs and trollocs in Lord of the Rings were supposed to represent industry,…

...because otherwise most of us would be dead. Or would never have lived, which is the same thing, kind of.

Re: Annual note to self: most of the world exists outside the tech bubble

#220

Post by mcguire »

PeterisP wrote: post #162
tinkerdol wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Mobility and a willingness to learn new skills seems to prevail. It's what other generations have done, millions of immigrants (my parents included). For an individual this might be a solution (even for me! I've moved around lots too) But for a whole society it's not. Especially when we seem to be hearing similar stories across thousands of towns and cities. Is everyone supposed to move to the bay area, NYC, Boston,…

The answer to your last paragraph, for the majority of people, is yes. That's how urbanization looks like. That's what the other generations have done. That's how it worked a hundred years ago, with a huge portion of people leaving countryside to relocate in urban centers, that's how it transformed China recently (uncountable millions of people moving from inland farming to their east coast manufacturing), that's how…

"That's how it worked a hundred years ago, with a huge portion of people leaving countryside to relocate in urban centers, that's how it transformed China recently (uncountable millions of people moving from inland farming to their east coast manufacturing),..."

There is the minor difference of moving from one location to take up relatively lucrative, but largely unskilled, jobs and moving from one location with a low-skilled job to try to find a high-skilled job. Or even from one high-skilled job to a completely different high-skilled job.

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