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Ad blocking is under attack

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Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#331

Post by sillysaurus3 »

stale2002 wrote: post #328
sillysaurus3 wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is getting away with the DMCA complaint. The target in this case did not file a counter notification. If they'd done that, then the DMCA complaint would be invalidated. You can argue that's unfair, but we don't have a justice system. We have a legal system. And these are the rules. Encoding it forces the DMCA filer to more comprehensively explain what is being violated. Basically it just raises the bar to a po…

Technical solutions to get around the legal system can work quite well. Just go ask all the not-in-jail users of The Pirate Bay. Github is a very above the table solution for distributing a list of things. But if it gets to expensive to host it there, due to frivolous lawsuit threats, I expect other solutions to distributing these lists start to pop up. The best advantage of encoding or even encrypting this stuff wou…

I'd be interested in examples of technical solutions evading the legal system. The Pirate Bay example is mistaken -- there are millions of people that use Pirate Bay with no VPN with no ill effects. But if you have specific, correct examples, then this is an area of some interest for me.

Regarding your point about obfuscation, I feel like people aren't thinking this through. It's on Github. The commit messages are public. Finding whether you're blocked is as simple as grepping the logs for your domain. And if you feel the people filing the DMCAs aren't technically capable, you may be underestimating them.

The advantage of having it on github far outweighs the negatives. How many contributors do you feel they gained from this publicity? Possibly at least one, which is one more than EasyList would've had otherwise.

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#332

Post by tzs »

komali2 wrote: post #165
nilved wrote: post #3

The DMCA only applies to the US. Fork the repo and move on. It's time to forget about American hosting.

What about when the USA sent super cops to rappel into Kim dotcoms house and kick down doors?

Dotcom was accused of doing things that are illegal in both the US and New Zealand (and around 200 other countries...). That's why New Zealand cooperated with the US's extradition request, including raiding Dotcom for the US.

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#333

Post by relevant_thing »

ransom1538 wrote: post #22
Spivak wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't joke. You really don't want to see these kinds of ravenous lawyers try to define website access not from an 'approved' browser as unauthorized access under the CFAA.

You could add to your TOS which browsers are approved. Using an unapproved browser would violate the current CFAA - under the current interpretation. Federal felony 1-5 years.

False. See 828 F.3d 1068 at 1077 (9th Cir. 2016):

>From those cases, we distill two general rules in analyzing authorization under the CFAA. ... Second, a violation of the terms of use of a website--without more--cannot be the basis for liability under the CFAA.

They say this because (Id. at 1076):

>"Not only are the terms of service vague and generally unknown . . . but website owners retain the right to change the terms at any time and without notice." [676 F.3d 854 (9th Cir. 2012)] at 862. As a result, imposing criminal liability for violations of the terms of use of a website could criminalize many daily activities. Accordingly, "the phrase 'exceeds authorized access' in the CFAA does not extend to violations of use restrictions. If Congress wants to incorporate misappropriation liability into the CFAA, it must speak more clearly." Id. at 863.

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#334

Post by greesil »

jxramos wrote: post #237
vinylkey wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, in that blog post, they state: "We asked them 24 days ago to remove functionalclam[.]com on the original commit." Their request is here: https://github.com/easylist/easylist/commit/1ba8d4afeec6d562... And was made by this account: https://github.com/dmcahelper So, they made a github account the same day they made the "request" with an account that in no way indicates where the request is coming from? The github p…

I wonder if folks could get sneaky and change the design from a literal url to a regular expression tailored to single out that url but would also include additional sites that are just gibberish and could be relaxed if useful sites ever do fall into the URL overlap. This might be a new line of research to craft regExs to filter out a specific string while also throwing out a bunch of sister gibberish strings that wo…

Why not just use a base 64 representation?

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#335

Post by feelin_googley »

A quick Google search reveals the following.

"Admiral identifies audiences with ad blockers turned on, works to re-establish those users (by opting in to a lightened ad experience, say, or asking to be whitelisted) and then makes a small cut of every ad served to the reacquired audience."

Source: https://adexchanger.com/publishers/another-ad-blocking-solut...

tl;dr Admiral is a startup that measures an audience's "ad block rate". If the rate is high, they then work to "establish explicit value propositions with users and then serve them with minimal tags and tracking". It also mentions plans to try to process micropayments.

"Admiral is built for a world where ad blockers have won."

Source: Id.

tl;dr Unless the founder has changed course from what is described in the 2016 article, as far as I can tell, this startup relies on widespread usage of adblockers. If users do not use adblockers, then this startup has nothing to sell.

VC: "What happens if the ad blockers block the servers that serve the ad blocker tracking image?"

Founder: "I'll send them DMCA notices."

VC: "Excellent. I'm in."

?

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#336

Post by jasonkostempski »

Overtonwindow wrote: post #227
ams6110 wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I already did.

I hadn't edited a hosts file since college, boy that was fun!

You can add it to "My filters" within uO. Host file has no wildcard support which you need for full coverage.

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#337

Post by dredmorbius »

jxramos wrote: post #237
vinylkey wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, in that blog post, they state: "We asked them 24 days ago to remove functionalclam[.]com on the original commit." Their request is here: https://github.com/easylist/easylist/commit/1ba8d4afeec6d562... And was made by this account: https://github.com/dmcahelper So, they made a github account the same day they made the "request" with an account that in no way indicates where the request is coming from? The github p…

I wonder if folks could get sneaky and change the design from a literal url to a regular expression tailored to single out that url but would also include additional sites that are just gibberish and could be relaxed if useful sites ever do fall into the URL overlap. This might be a new line of research to craft regExs to filter out a specific string while also throwing out a bunch of sister gibberish strings that wo…

Or hashes.

Which will make administration rather more complex.

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#339

Post by Animats »

cyphar wrote: post #189
anilgulecha wrote: post #32

It was admiral that did this: https://blog.getadmiral.com/dmca-easylist-adblock-copyright-... They even clearly state they used the only tool available to them, DCMA. From all the current summaries on this, DMCA does not apply to a line entry in easylist. A domain can be trademarked. This should be added back in. And if github cannot standup to DMCA abuse, then well, easylist and all other developers should be giving…

> From all the current summaries on this, DMCA does not apply to a line entry in easylist. A domain can be trademarked. I believe you can trademark a domain, but trademarks are irrelevant to this discussion. The DMCA is a copyright law. The key questions are: a) Can you have copyright over a domain? (According to https://copyright.gov , no) b) If you could, would having a list of them constitute fair use? (Almost cer…

It's not clear how trademarks would apply here. I can write "General Motors". I can write about General Motors. I just can't impersonate General Motors or their products. That's trademark.

Re: Ad blocking is under attack

#340

Post by rad_gruchalski »

nilved wrote: post #326
fenollp wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about having EasyList clients fetch the whole history of the repo? That way any domain that was ever added would be in the blocklist. True negatives should be pretty low.

Then they would purge it from the repo. In fact, it's questionably the case that they have abided by the DMCA order, for the very reason that it still exists in the repo history. As far as I know, DMCA takedowns normally lead to closing the entire repo.

How about don't host the code at a location which has such hostile laws?
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