Large companies are like a big analog machines run largely by human power. The machine absorbs lot of power and produces large output. The large output shouldn't be compared to that of individual's share for helping run that machinery.
A note on programmer salaries
121–130 of 230 posts
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
Berlin wages are really low in my experience. After taxes maybe 2000-3000 euros per month.
That is exactly why I am asking. When I investigated Berlin I was rather surprised by how low the wages are.
But then again you can (theoretically) rent something good for less money, healthcare is "free" (your employers has to pay insurance), transport system is great
And it was ok-ish safe (in 2013, not sure about now)
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#123I am continually surprised that _anyone_ in tech signs employment contracts in Europe. If you're good, and know how to work well remotely, contract work at 130-150€/hr is plentiful. Working 32 (billable) hrs/wk with 6 weeks vacation - more or less what you'd do as an Employee - that's an income between 190-220k. But every employment contract I've heard of here (France and Germany) maxes out at 90-100k for even direct…
What I always find difficult is - as fresh graduate, where would I start?
I have no experience (besides internships) and no connections.
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#124I am continually surprised that _anyone_ in tech signs employment contracts in Europe. If you're good, and know how to work well remotely, contract work at 130-150€/hr is plentiful. Working 32 (billable) hrs/wk with 6 weeks vacation - more or less what you'd do as an Employee - that's an income between 190-220k. But every employment contract I've heard of here (France and Germany) maxes out at 90-100k for even direct…
>> If you're good, and know how to work well remotely, contract work at 130-150€/hr is plentiful
What kind of work ? if you have a phd you can't have research work that way can you ?
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#125By looking at her Linkedin, it is easy to see what companies she is talking about, some big names up there. I think her viewpoint is a bit naive though. Of course a company will pay market rate in a european city if that is what it takes to be competitive. The fact that they pay their US employees more might create tensions inside the company but in the end is just down to the fact that the market there is completely…
Out of interest which European tech hub did you move to? Berlin? I am currently looking at making a move and would love to hear some first hand experience of the tech hubs in Europe that people have moved to.
A quick search on Stack Overflow careers shows that while there are many Berlin startups that don't pay well compared to U.S. salaries (say, 60k€ range), there are also a lot of multinationals that pay great salaries; I've seen senior dev jobs up to 130k _salary_ here. Competition seems to be heating up so I only expect salaries to rise accordingly.
Here's an example (data scientist, but still counts in my book): https://stackoverflow.com/jobs/148268/senior-data-scientist-...
I know there are also offices of Google, Facebook, AirBnB, Pinterest in Berlin, although I'm not sure which of those have developers.
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#126By looking at her Linkedin, it is easy to see what companies she is talking about, some big names up there. I think her viewpoint is a bit naive though. Of course a company will pay market rate in a european city if that is what it takes to be competitive. The fact that they pay their US employees more might create tensions inside the company but in the end is just down to the fact that the market there is completely…
Out of interest which European tech hub did you move to? Berlin? I am currently looking at making a move and would love to hear some first hand experience of the tech hubs in Europe that people have moved to.
Yes Berlin, i make close to 70k which is decent here for senior devs without management responsibility i guess and that amounts to ~3300 after taxes, health insurance etc. I could save more by getting a private health insurance, but that has its downsides too.
The main reason why this works is that Berlin is still really cheap compared to London but even compared to Hamburg or Munich. Rents are getting up though, still the amount of great food and entertainment for relatively cheap makes it easy to live with that salary.
I read an article from Buffer where they equaled 60k in Berlin to about 120k in SF or NY. I also think salaries in London are not substantially higher, while the city is so much more expensive.
I am still looking to go contracting at some point to make more money to raise a family, but for now while sharing an apartment with my girlfriend, it's decent money. Most of Berlin's working population gets far lower wages anyway, even in startups outside of development so for me as someone without an degree (yet), it always feels weird to earn substantially more than people that have a Masters in Business/Marketing.
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
Out of interest which European tech hub did you move to? Berlin? I am currently looking at making a move and would love to hear some first hand experience of the tech hubs in Europe that people have moved to.
A quick search on Stack Overflow careers shows that while there are many Berlin startups that don't pay well compared to U.S. salaries (say, 60k€ range), there are also a lot of multinationals that pay great salaries; I've seen senior dev jobs up to 130k _salary_ here. Competition seems to be heating up so I only expect salaries to rise accordingly. Here's an example (data scientist, but still counts in my book): htt…
What are those 130k jobs you have seen as an example? For pure dev roles, i haven't seen much above 80-90k EUR (which is still a lot of money in Berlin)
Even the one you posted has a range from 80-130k, i doubt 130k is really possible there, but interesting none the less!
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#128By looking at her Linkedin, it is easy to see what companies she is talking about, some big names up there. I think her viewpoint is a bit naive though. Of course a company will pay market rate in a european city if that is what it takes to be competitive. The fact that they pay their US employees more might create tensions inside the company but in the end is just down to the fact that the market there is completely…
Is it Berlin you've ended up into ?
Yes. Rent obviously went up a bit, but not dramatically though and the rest pretty much stayed the same. Good food is incredibly affordable here.
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#129I am continually surprised that _anyone_ in tech signs employment contracts in Europe. If you're good, and know how to work well remotely, contract work at 130-150€/hr is plentiful. Working 32 (billable) hrs/wk with 6 weeks vacation - more or less what you'd do as an Employee - that's an income between 190-220k. But every employment contract I've heard of here (France and Germany) maxes out at 90-100k for even direct…
Hey there,
Londoner here feeling quite constrained with salaries, curious where you find 130-150/hr remote gigs. Mostly through a personal network? Or a recruiter? Really curious.
Re: A note on programmer salaries
#130Yes well I don't know where these enormously successful companies are in europe with millions going to some non-deserving CEO. Sure there may be some that do reasonably well, but It is quite a cut throat industry.
100k+ salaries seem downright ridiculous from an european perspective. (When not talking about facebook, google and other wildly successfull companies mainly serving the ad industry)