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Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

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Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#71

Post by biggerbistro »

UncleMeat wrote: post #62
biggerbistro wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is this elitist? Do most people understand the current financial system in any meaningful way? Do most people understand how their computers work? How their air conditioner works? How about the pressure dynamics that make their toilets flush? Saying everyone can't mine it is inaccurate, everyone can mine it even with a smartphone. Is it profitable? No, but neither is mining iron ore with a shovel. Those with the…

Because our financial system isn't portrayed as a technology that will bring the power to the people and free us from the shackles of elite organizations. Bitcoin is presented this way.

Bitcoin won't free people who won't lift a finger to learn it just like the US constitution won't protect people unwilling to defend it. I've yet to meet someone who is unable to understand the basic use of bitcoin (sending and receiving) and if we are trying to cater to the lowest common denominator we have already lost. It is worrying that we have resorted to scrapping a new technology just because lazy or incompetent people are unable to completely master it.

Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#72

Post by csuwldcat »

charlesdm wrote: post #65
thephyber wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 99.5% can't mine it. Not relevant. Mining is no longer profitable for any new entrants without some incredible innovation in computing power or electricity costs. Even the miners are unlikely to make money from mining only from holding their mining gains as investments. > 99% of the world's population can't understand it. That's underselling the human population. I would posit 10-20% are probably mentally incapable…

I understand how Bitcoin works and I understand how the technology itself is useful and valuable + has some interesting use cases. However, with the exception of a few use cases e.g. countries with high and/or hyperinflation, what I don't understand is why the currency Bitcoin has any value at all. Frankly, if anything, it still looks more like a massive bubble to me. Unless you already own Bitcoin, why would I ever…

Bitcoin is a store of value that will long-term net-increase as true monetary bubbles, like this: http://imgur.com/a/0ZoDu, pop and cause their base currencies to long-term net-decrease.

Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#73

Post by charlesdm »

jstanley wrote: post #68
charlesdm wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand how Bitcoin works and I understand how the technology itself is useful and valuable + has some interesting use cases. However, with the exception of a few use cases e.g. countries with high and/or hyperinflation, what I don't understand is why the currency Bitcoin has any value at all. Frankly, if anything, it still looks more like a massive bubble to me. Unless you already own Bitcoin, why would I ever…

If you don't already own USD, why would you ever consider paying for something in USD? Because the person you're trying to pay only wants USD. And eventually, if you start getting paid in USD, it becomes only natural to pay others in USD.

Right. But fiat currency will never disappear in favour of Bitcoin, nor will it be replaced by Bitcoin. Taxes will also have to be paid in fiat, etc.

The comparison is akin to someone in Europe exchanging EUR to USD as an investment, because he's betting on the fx rate. But why would the average European ever need to hold USD? Not that many situations that make sense either.

Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#74

Post by [deleted] »

jstanley wrote: post #68
charlesdm wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand how Bitcoin works and I understand how the technology itself is useful and valuable + has some interesting use cases. However, with the exception of a few use cases e.g. countries with high and/or hyperinflation, what I don't understand is why the currency Bitcoin has any value at all. Frankly, if anything, it still looks more like a massive bubble to me. Unless you already own Bitcoin, why would I ever…

If you don't already own USD, why would you ever consider paying for something in USD? Because the person you're trying to pay only wants USD. And eventually, if you start getting paid in USD, it becomes only natural to pay others in USD.

[deleted]

Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#75

Post by pbhjpbhj »

Talyen42 wrote: post #46

How many people understand the federal reserve, money supply, minting process, and quantitative easing? How on earth do people use USD?! It's so complicated!

If the USA government used BTC as default then people would probably use it without caring too. Early adopters need to understand things to be sure they're not falling for a con; people getting electric vehicles are probably much more interested in the technical and financial details than your average car buyer. Once they've established the system works then others can get in.

Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#77

Post by charlesdm »

csuwldcat wrote: post #72
charlesdm wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand how Bitcoin works and I understand how the technology itself is useful and valuable + has some interesting use cases. However, with the exception of a few use cases e.g. countries with high and/or hyperinflation, what I don't understand is why the currency Bitcoin has any value at all. Frankly, if anything, it still looks more like a massive bubble to me. Unless you already own Bitcoin, why would I ever…

Bitcoin is a store of value that will long-term net-increase as true monetary bubbles, like this: http://imgur.com/a/0ZoDu , pop and cause their base currencies to long-term net-decrease.

Aren't you just transferring from one asset (bubble) into another? Holding your wealth in shares of a company is a way to combat that, so is holding real estate and other assets (e.g. IP rights).

Something can't be a reliable store of value if it can drop (or increase) 50-100-200% in a day. That is, in the best case, a speculative instrument.

If I had $50m, why wouldn't I invest it in property rather than in Bitcoin?

Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#78

Post by csuwldcat »

phkahler wrote: post #61
thephyber wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 99.5% can't mine it. Not relevant. Mining is no longer profitable for any new entrants without some incredible innovation in computing power or electricity costs. Even the miners are unlikely to make money from mining only from holding their mining gains as investments. > 99% of the world's population can't understand it. That's underselling the human population. I would posit 10-20% are probably mentally incapable…

>> Even the miners are unlikely to make money from mining only from holding their mining gains as investments. And that's why I've been calling it a Ponzi scheme lately. Once mining become unprofitable, or even impossible (asymptotically) people will stop mining, but the blockchain only works if people keep mining. At some point it's got to fail doesn't it?

False - mining in Bitcoin (which is really just transaction processing) is based on a math/crypto difficulty algo, and the system automatically adjusts itself every ~two weeks to fit the load/prevalence of miners and their block-finding success rates.

Re: Bitcoin Makes Even Smart People Feel Dumb

#79

Post by jstanley »

charlesdm wrote: post #73
jstanley wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't already own USD, why would you ever consider paying for something in USD? Because the person you're trying to pay only wants USD. And eventually, if you start getting paid in USD, it becomes only natural to pay others in USD.

Right. But fiat currency will never disappear in favour of Bitcoin, nor will it be replaced by Bitcoin. Taxes will also have to be paid in fiat, etc. The comparison is akin to someone in Europe exchanging EUR to USD as an investment, because he's betting on the fx rate. But why would the average European ever need to hold USD? Not that many situations that make sense either.

I hear what you're saying, but I personally think you're wrong.

I think fiat currency will disappear in favour of bitcoin (or similar), and I think it will happen within only a small number of generations.

It will happen because bitcoin (or similar) is a superior form of money.

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