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Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

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Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#211

Post by imron »

te_chris wrote: post #54
kbart wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"your evidence being psuedo-scientific bullshit" *Citation needed.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/07/silico...

Counter citation: http://quillette.com/2017/08/07/google-memo-four-scientists-...

This part in particular is worth considering:

"..if minds differ across sexes and races enough to justify diversity as an instrumental business goal, then they must differ enough in some specific skills, interests, and motivations that hiring and promotion will sometimes produce unequal outcomes in some company roles. In other words, if demographic diversity yields any competitive advantages due to psychological differences between groups, then demographic equality of outcome cannot be achieved in all jobs and all levels within a company."

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#212

Post by Mangalor »

supremesaboteur wrote: post #144

This is the moment. Google used to be this dream place to work, not anymore. If other companies want to hire good conservative/libertarian engineers, they should motion loud and clear that they will not ostracize employees for having a differing political opinion

The truth is, in most states, you can be fired for holding any opinion your boss doesn't like. Full stop.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#213

Post by rewrew »

Let's break down the reality of this situation as it currently stands:

1) You can't say what you want at work, period (there are no first amendment protections at work, just from the government). The person who posted the memo was naive and this memo from the CEO is corporate bullspeak to look good for outside PR. That's all this is, and if you take it for anything more you're also naive. For all intents and purposes it means nothing.

2) The company might be trying to make women feel more welcome by having the statement from the new diversity officer and the CEO, but I can tell you as a woman the LAST place I'd want to get a job right now is Google -- everyone is going to look at you like you only got your job because you're female; it's going to be extremely hard to get people to take you seriously. That's why, if you're going to hire only for diversity (not that I recommend it), do it in silence, don't tell the world, as it only backfires against those same employees you're bringing in.

3) If Google really wanted to get more females and minorities in its rank it should be looking at why it focuses so highly on only top rank schools (IF TRUE: MAY NOT BE-- SEE DISCUSSION BELOW) -- there's plenty of great, smart people constantly overlooked by Google because they can't see past their own biases in this area, which some would argue is a bigger barrier to diversity at Google than straight hiring by gender and race alone.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#214

Post by pas »

sremani wrote: post #166
cnlwsu wrote: post #150

Keep politics/religion out of work. Its one thing to rant on reddit at end of day, its another to broadcast it to co workers. What did he expect would happen? His little write up would change everyones mind? Both left/right are extremists these days and will never change. All you will do is alienate and anger a bunch of co workers for a few pats on back from "your" side. While the smart people will put heads down and…

There was a political rally in Google Campuses in Feb 2017. So, may be you vanilla comments are generally applicable, Google has sort of exempted itself. Now some people in Google are creating black-lists of colleagues. http://www.breitbart.com/tech/2017/08/07/revealed-inside-goo...

That's not "now". People were doing this in these recent years.

And it's sort of ... makes sense. You should be allowed to augment your mind with fucking spreadsheets/lists.

It's different if a government/company does it.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#215

Post by dyarosla »

xenadu02 wrote: post #165
tedmiston wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At the same time, there are co-workers who are questioning whether they can safely express their views in the workplace (especially those with a minority viewpoint). Minority viewpoints in tech become silenced and their author(s) ostracized by the biases of a mob mentality. It doesn't even matter what you write because most people won't even read the original source, instead floating by on derivative tweets and ext…

This was only ever true in online discussion forums, Usenet, etc. I agree that there is a lot of mob mentality going on, it’s just difficult to get upset about this case because the original author was spouting debunked “biotruth” arguments. Twitter replies are mostly full of men who didn’t read the original memo or who are willfully pretending it didn’t claim women are less biologically suited to being engineers. I…

Please provide a quote from the article that is a 'debunked biotruth', just one will suffice.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#216

Post by [deleted] »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #156
Mangalor wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

False equivalency. The left at least advocates for inclusion, and asking your workplace not to discriminate is not "just as bad as" saying women shouldn't be able to be engineers.

> asking your workplace not to discriminate is not "just as bad as" saying women shouldn't be able to be engineers The former is exactly what the author of the memo did, and they got fired for it.

[deleted]

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#217

Post by shaggerty »

humanrebar wrote: post #71
h4l0 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Misconduct would be expressing these views under his blog while putting emphasis on Google and blaming his company for what he finds unreasonable. He used internal messaging services. Someone leaked the document. That "someone" is sitting in his/her office today getting no punishment whatsoever.

I haven't read the code of conduct, and I'm disappointed the person was fired, but I presume there's a clause about saying bigoted things. And people consider parts of what he said bigoted.

Its intetesting how in the last couple years bigot has been redefined from "someone who is not tolerant of the opinions of others" to "anyone who disagrees with leftist moral thought"

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#218

Post by jamesrcole »

conradfr wrote: post #203
jamesrcole wrote: post #13

By firing the employee, Google is sending a strong signal that they will not tolerate a diversity of opinions. That does not bode well for them, for a restrictive intellectual environment is anathema to the kind of intelligent people they want to hire to keep the company competitive.

Google has enough money to survive everything for decades. It may not be the case for smaller companies that love to copy what they do.

> Google has enough money to survive everything for decades.

How much money they have, and how long it'd be possible to survive on that, is not relevant to the point I was making.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#219

Post by SJWDisagree111 »

The word "neurotic" was the single thing that got this blown up. Had that not been used this would have skated by mostly unnoticed. I guess also got the author would also have been added to these blacklists. The author might as well have used the "B" word with all the SJW's around at Google.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#220

Post by SJWDisagree111 »

The word "neurotic" was the single thing that got this blown up. Had that not been used this would have skated by mostly unnoticed. I guess also got the author would also have been added to these blacklists. The author might as well have used the "B" word with all the SJW's around at Google.
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