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Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

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Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#71

Post by anindha »

reza_n wrote: post #55
choxi wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it a problem, or what problems has it been causing in NYC? I understand the legality is questionable but I don't know why the laws exist in the first place.

It converts long term housing stock into short term housing, which benefits tourists with cheaper prices and increases the price for residents since both are competing for the same units. Basically, tourists are getting a free ride on the backs of residents. Its always been the other way around, tourists pay extra taxes and fees which go back to the city (and residents) and entrepreneurs build hotels which once again…

This is spot on. Also having a hotel next door is easy to spot when you are looking for a new place.

I think Airbnb is a good idea with regulation that limits the number of weeks you can rent out your place.

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#72

Post by bradleyjg »

choxi wrote: post #26
cletus wrote: post #17

Put me in the camp that's very anti-AirBnB as a resident who doesn't want where I lived turned into a hotel. I live in NYC. It's a problem. None of this is a surprise, so much so that AirBnB seems to be aware of this and is acting in a way that's, at best, ethically challenged and, at worst, illegal eg deleting listings before giving data to the state of NY that "shows" most hosts only have one unit [1]. If people wa…

Why is it a problem, or what problems has it been causing in NYC? I understand the legality is questionable but I don't know why the laws exist in the first place.

All the sibling comments as of this writing are about the effects on long term rent prices. But I think the bigger issue is the effect on neighbors, especially but not exclusively, in-building neighbors.

Being in a rental building that's all people with at least one year leases is different from being in a building where a third of units are hotel rooms. It'd be one thing if the landlord had chosen to have that kind of mixed building and let renters know up front. But in a lot cases it is being done without the permission of the landlord and in every case it is being done without disclosure.

At the block level, living on a block with residential housing is different from living on a block with four hotels. I'm in favor of loosening zoning rules, but as long as they exist we shouldn't reward people for breaking them. Not only does that encourage other anti-social behavior it also reduces the pressure to reform the laws.

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#73

Post by Frondo »

cjalmeida wrote: post #52
jmcgough wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it further reduces the number of homes available for people to actually live (which is why we have zoning laws), which inflates rent/housing prices. This forces the bottom rung out of the city, because they can't afford to live there, and now minimum wage jobs (which we need to run the services people want) can't be filled, artists and musicians disappear, and the city becomes a place only for tourists and th…

How's that different than what's being going on NYC for the past 30 years or so? Gentrification is a thing, Airbnb or not.

These apps and startups and technology in general can certainly accelerate the shift from one status quo to a new one; AirBNB and Uber have disrupted hotel and taxi industries, certainly.

The question we should be asking, as a society, is the new status quo one we want? Is it making life better overall? Or is it one that only a few of us want, because they're getting rich while the rest of us are getting more hard done by?

If tech is pushing us to a new status quo, and it's one we want (like a lot of medical technology), then that's great, the societal conversation will be short: yes, we like it, let's go.

If the tech is pushing us to a new status quo that we don't want, that's when we need to reevaluate, and maybe regulate it.

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#74

Post by cabaalis »

sisyphusprotege wrote: post #35
throwaway413 wrote: post #19

The last Airbnb I rented was from a dude managing 28 other properties, all listed on Airbnb.

That's the kind of pluck and industriousness that made this country great.

Thank you, somebody who gets it. "But my neighbors are complaining!" has somehow trumped "It's my property." in the modern age.

If neighbors don't like what their neighborhood is becoming, they should move. Aside from homeowners group contracts, a person should be able to do as they wish with what they own.

I'd bet that's the feeling of a good majority of people on this site regarding computer equipment and personal electronics. Strange they don't feel the same for real estate.

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#75

Post by santoshalper »

exogeny wrote: post #21
cletus wrote: post #17

Put me in the camp that's very anti-AirBnB as a resident who doesn't want where I lived turned into a hotel. I live in NYC. It's a problem. None of this is a surprise, so much so that AirBnB seems to be aware of this and is acting in a way that's, at best, ethically challenged and, at worst, illegal eg deleting listings before giving data to the state of NY that "shows" most hosts only have one unit [1]. If people wa…

In NYC here as well; I think AirBNB is a pox. It's a great and useful product, I can't dispute that. But the economic ramifications of it outweigh the benefits by a large margin. And when you add on the unregulated latent racism (multiple reports, too lazy to cite) and the fact that there's next to zero safety checks in place for things like smoke detectors and so on, it's really sort of surprising that so many peopl…

Because, like Uber, for customers it is a massive improvement over the alternative.

I am taking my family to Atlanta next week for my son's birthday. Using AirBNB (or equivalent service) saved me well over $1500 for the trip - we would have needed three hotel rooms but rented a house instead. As an added bonus, instead of all that money going to a large corporation, it will go to an individual.

The level of myopia here is staggering. The sharing economy is a tidal wave of economic change - mostly for good. You'd throw pebbles at it trying to stop it. It's both wrongheaded and comically pointless.

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#76

Post by EGreg »

And bitcoin is dominated by professional miners.

Open source and the Web is dominated by large corporations like Google and Facebook.

And sports tickets and restaurant reservations are scalped.

I wonder if all these peer to peer marketplaces tend to become dominated by professionals and even the original industry they are supposed to disrupt.

Wikipedia seems to have prevented this, as has HN.

Any solutions?

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#77

Post by archagon »

3pt14159 wrote: post #51

Look, we have a couple problems: low interest rates, large variance in productivity / earnings, really shitty hotels because they're operating on old-world assumptions. One under appreciated thing about apps like Uber and AirBnb is the star rating system. I know I'm a five star tenant. I know I never shit in the sink. I know I never leave a bunch of condoms or cigar butts all over the balcony or hotel room. But the h…

Airbnb is one of those rare products that cracked open an entire world of possibilities for me. For the first time, I've gotten the chance to live as a local all around the world, for even less money than at a hotel or sometimes even a hostel. Ordinary folks just didn't travel like this in the past, getting to know distant cities right from the ground floor. Adjustments should be made on a city-to-city basis, but you can't put the genie back in the bottle. The rewards are just too sweet!

(For the record, I've mostly stayed in shared accommodations, since entire apartment rentals are very expensive for prolonged travel. It seems people are mostly OK with this side of Airbnb.)

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#78

Post by OldSchoolJohnny »

3pt14159 wrote: post #51

Look, we have a couple problems: low interest rates, large variance in productivity / earnings, really shitty hotels because they're operating on old-world assumptions. One under appreciated thing about apps like Uber and AirBnb is the star rating system. I know I'm a five star tenant. I know I never shit in the sink. I know I never leave a bunch of condoms or cigar butts all over the balcony or hotel room. But the h…

Speaking as someone who is experiencing the implications of a super low rental vacancy rate, I think most people in my situation are with me when we say shut it down, entirely, in any city with a low tenancy vacancy rate. It's hurting society at large to the benefit of a precious few.

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#79

Post by santoshalper »

ricardobeat wrote: post #27

'Our members own seven apartments on average, they are not big companies' Amazing how people live in distorted realities. To the vast majority of the population, owning seven apartments definitely puts you into 'big company' territory. Plus not being 'big' doesn't mean you get any exemptions.

Owning seven rental properties puts you squarely in the "small business" category by any definition. Big companies like Marriott have well over a million hotel rooms spread over thousands of properties.

Re: Airbnb dominated by professional landlords

#80

Post by gist »

santoshalper wrote: post #75
exogeny wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In NYC here as well; I think AirBNB is a pox. It's a great and useful product, I can't dispute that. But the economic ramifications of it outweigh the benefits by a large margin. And when you add on the unregulated latent racism (multiple reports, too lazy to cite) and the fact that there's next to zero safety checks in place for things like smoke detectors and so on, it's really sort of surprising that so many peopl…

Because, like Uber, for customers it is a massive improvement over the alternative. I am taking my family to Atlanta next week for my son's birthday. Using AirBNB (or equivalent service) saved me well over $1500 for the trip - we would have needed three hotel rooms but rented a house instead. As an added bonus, instead of all that money going to a large corporation, it will go to an individual. The level of myopia he…

> Using AirBNB (or equivalent service) saved me well over $1500 for the trip - we would have needed three hotel rooms but rented a house instead.

Travel and entertainment is not one of life's necessities. It doesn't outweigh the negative impact of airbnb.

> As an added bonus, instead of all that money going to a large corporation, it will go to an individual.

Why in the world does that matter at all? Are you saying that you have not received any upside from interacting over the years with 'a large corporation'? And that they have no value? Or that you think it just makes you a better person because your money went to an individual as if you have just donated to a person or charity in need?

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