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Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

bbc.com

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Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#291

Post by dkersten »

pragone wrote: post #166
rdtsc wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the choice of having a father at home or have one dead in cave but famous for exploring cool places I don't think it's hard to guess what most children would pick. > The good news is that once you become a father, you'll get to decide (possibly with a partner) what the acceptable level of risk is for you and your family. That's a obvious. What I think is being questioned is if they made a good decision. In othe…

> Given the choice of having a father at home or have one dead in cave but famous for exploring cool places I don't think it's hard to guess what most children would pick. In all seriousness, I do have a hard time guessing which one most children would pick. I can see reasonable arguments made on either side. Personally, I think it would be far more inspiring to have a father who died pursuing his passion, then one w…

My father died when I was 8 and I know a number of others who lost a parent as a child and, while I know this is anecdotal, every single one would rather have their parent. Every single one would rather have a dead-beat (but not abusive, I imagine that would change the equation) dad over no dad.

Also, from the article: "My children don't like it much but they don't tell me not to do it"

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#292

Post by ionised »

Xero wrote: post #50
sametmax wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can decide that having children doesn't mean you have to sacrifice everything for them. If you greatest joy in life is this, you may choose to take the risk. Children are not an all or nothing proposal.

"Children are not an all or nothing proposal." I'm not sure I understand this mentality. Why force a life into this existence if you don't do everything in your power to make it as accommodating as you can? Modern life in it of itself will be working against it.

Your attitude is a very recent one in human history.

The person you are responding to is espousing an atittude that is far older and more widespread throughout the world.

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#293

Post by ionised »

QAPereo wrote: post #67
j9461701 wrote: post #33

I might be speaking out of line, but taking on these kinds of risks with young children at home seems kind of selfish. The fact that he went back into the same cave that nearly killed him only a month later...almost as if to say: "I would rather my kids grow up without a Dad than live without my adrenaline fix" I am neither a father or a cave diver though, so I might be missing a piece of the puzzle. Would either gro…

When you start to look at thrillseekers as addicts, it starts to make a lot more sense. It's just that to get high, they take risks instead of using drugs, but the personality and the lack of concern for others in the face of that addiction is more than just similar I believe.

So now we're comparing explorers to drug addicts.

Are fucking serious?

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#294

Post by Aaargh20318 »

coleifer wrote: post #40
j9461701 wrote: post #33

I might be speaking out of line, but taking on these kinds of risks with young children at home seems kind of selfish. The fact that he went back into the same cave that nearly killed him only a month later...almost as if to say: "I would rather my kids grow up without a Dad than live without my adrenaline fix" I am neither a father or a cave diver though, so I might be missing a piece of the puzzle. Would either gro…

I race motorcycles and also ride on the street most days, so this is a familiar topic of discussion with my wife, especially considering that we have a two-year-old son. What I can say on the subject is that there's a big difference between taking every precaution to minimize risk and being careless or reckless. What stood out to me when reading this article was "why the fuck would you use a guideline that could brea…

> What I can say on the subject is that there's a big difference between taking every precaution to minimize risk and being careless or reckless.

I've heard people who work in the ER refer to motorcycles as "donorcycles", apparently they are a great source of donor organs. It's probably not because they are very safe.

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#295

Post by mseebach »

Someone wrote: post #246
jonahx wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you just asked them, in all their ignorance, you're undoubtedly right. If you asked the children who chose the adventurous dad after he had died pursuing his passion, nearly 100% would trade the world to reverse that choice.

The 'choice' isn't between "dull and alive" and "adventurous and dead", but between "dull, 99.9% chance of living to an old age" and "adventurous, 95% chance of living to an old age" (actual percentages for illustration only) I think many kids, especially those with an adventurous mom/dad, would think "my mom/dad is strong and knows what he is doing, so (s)he won't be in that 5%"

The top-GP didn't say "adventurous", they said chasing "adrenaline fix". You can be adventurous without exposing yourself to fatal danger (and you can be an adrenaline fix chaser and be a really, really dull person to be around).

> I think many kids, especially those with an adventurous mom/dad, would think "my mom/dad is strong and knows what he is doing, so (s)he won't be in that 5%"

Not this guy's:

> "My children don't like it much but they don't tell me not to do it," he says.

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#297

Post by QAPereo »

ionised wrote: post #293
QAPereo wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you start to look at thrillseekers as addicts, it starts to make a lot more sense. It's just that to get high, they take risks instead of using drugs, but the personality and the lack of concern for others in the face of that addiction is more than just similar I believe.

So now we're comparing explorers to drug addicts. Are fucking serious?

Yes, very much, and there's research to back up my point. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3604176/

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0166432815...

It's the same circuitry involved in taking drugs or gambling, or jumping out of airplanes.

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#298

Post by mercer »

JshWright wrote: post #150
putsteadywere wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really liked this: 'I have seen lots of parents do terrible things because they failed to "put their own oxygen mask on first."' Thanks for writing that!

To take this tangent even further afield... Here's an actual real life demonstration of why you should put your oxygen mask on first: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUfF2MTnqAw

This is one of my favorite Youtube videos and I'm not entirely sure why. Worth a watch, especially if the topic interests you.

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#299

Post by Chris2048 »

always_good wrote: post #269
Chris2048 wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not really sure what you are saying. "drop everything" is hyperbole - just drop the things with a higher chance of killing you.

Your comments are a good reminder of why HN needs a per-submission limit on the number of comments a single user can make. Yes, you've shared your point. Now you're dominating the discussion by responding to everyone with the same exact moralizing comment.

Why? Because you don't like my opinion? Then why not contribute constructively rather than fling mud?

Re: Two days in an underwater cave running out of oxygen

#300

Post by vertex-four »

cafebabbe wrote: post #261
vertex-four wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taken to the extreme, your suggestion would be to never drive a car (or indeed go anywhere near a public road), as that is one of the most dangerous things we do every day. Travelling for a holiday would be a definite no-no, as it's likely more dangerous than staying at home. And so on and so forth.

Anything taken to the extreme is stupid. What's the point exactly ?

The point is mostly to show that we consider a lot of things "safe" that are actually really dangerous. We then do those things with absolutely no regard to the people around us. But as soon as someone does something different that's dangerous to pretty much any degree, people start to care. It makes no sense.
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