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Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

scientificamerican.com

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Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#161
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe they aren't as effective as hand written notes. but in my case Neatly typed, well organized notes using OneNote 2003 were more effective than hastily hand written mostly illegible notes.

The reason hand written notes are more effective is that it helps towards better learning just by writing the thing down and slowing it to a pace where your mind can make memories. Even if afterwards the notes are completely illegible, I would argue it's more effective than typed notes.

I don't disagree that there are pros to hand writing notes. However There are other ways to build those connections in your mind.

I spent my first year and a half of college at a community college. They arent exactly known for their academic rigor. However first semester I took World History 1. There were only like 3 tests and 5 Quizzes that made up our grade. The tests were not multiple choice or fill in the blank like some professors might do. They were several short essay questions and a long form essay. You would have a choice of like 6 short essay questions which you had to pick 3 to answer. and then had a choice of 3 long essay topics from which we had to pick one.

The Professor about 2 weeks prior to the exams gave us a handout of 12 short essay questions and 6 long essay questions. He randomized the questions that were on the test so that while we knew what questions were possibly going to be on the test we did not know which ones would. He also expected us to know both the facts such as people, places, dates and events. but also the concepts. If you only got the concepts but did not know the factual material you were in trouble and vice versa.

I took all my notes in that class on a laptop using OneNote 2003 (It came out right at the start of my first semester in college.)

As the semester went on I got into the habit of skimming over my previous notes for that class and adding annotations about connections to other concepts and facts in the class. I also would review my notes at the end of the day while it was still fresh in my mind, but had taken some time to digest the material to add things that I missed or make my notes more clear.

When it came time to start preparing for the tests the first thing I did was take my notes, create a new section in my notebook just for that test. I took all my notes for that test and instead of organizing them by lecture, i condensed them into a more concise and coherent form that linked all the different concepts and facts together. I also outlined my strategy for each question. Then I printed it out and put it in a ring binder, as I refined my notes, I printed out new copies for the binder. I probably printed about 200 pages for each test.

Maybe Writing them out would have been more effective for memorization in most cases. But to me there was simply too much information to memorize in one pass. and Wrot memorization was not going to cut in this class. I also think the fact that I was constantly working with those notes and synthesizing new material from them, replaced alot of the feedback loop of writing it all out by hand.

I learned a lot of history in that class. But more importantly I learned how to interpret requirements, sift through large amounts of information, making connections between that information and developing strategies to accomplish a goal.

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#162
post #143

Students are also better off without forcible teacher's unions and federal curriculum mandates; no chance of hearing about that. Maybe the best way out of this mess is vouchers. If the schools are functioning, it should be obvious to them that the laptops are not working out.

Where have vouchers proven effective? If anything, we need to follow Finland's lead and ban paying for school. Segregating students by economic class has not improved education in the United States, about the only effects are 30+% unvaccinated rates in private (mainly Catholic) schools, and strong clique effects that allow so so students from said schools to do notably better than those from nearby public schools. Al…

Finland does not have compulsory union membership for teachers, they just happen to have a large and fairly reasonable teacher's union which serves most teachers well under threat of competition.

In the U.S. and here in Canada, you are (in most places) under compulsion to pay and participate in a specific union.

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#163

Oh, okay, I thought the study was going to be on the benefits of attempting to use the laptop itself for classroom purposes, not for social media distractions. This would be more accurately titled, "Students Are Better Off Without Distractions in the Classroom." Though I suppose, it wouldn't make a very catchy headline. I found my laptop to be very beneficial in my classroom learning during college, but only when I m…

>I opened up a word processor, focused my eyes on the professor's slides or visual aids, and typed everything I saw There are studies that show that verbatim computer note taking is actually inferior to remembering the lecture content: A Learning Secret: Don’t Take Notes with a Laptop https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/a-learning-secret...

I took a two pass approach: hand written notes (I can write equations faster than I can LaTeX them) and then follow up by writing a LaTeX document for each lecture. I had a rule that I wasn't allowed to continue typing up until I understood how each step in the derivation was made. If it was non-obvious, I'd write textbook-style comments around things to explain how to get from line to the next.

Worked pretty well for most courses and meant I had explanations of everything come revise time. The only problem is it took about 4 years to really nail down the routine and by the time I had it perfect (I really wish I'd done it in first year), it was time to leave. Such is life.

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#164

Oh, okay, I thought the study was going to be on the benefits of attempting to use the laptop itself for classroom purposes, not for social media distractions. This would be more accurately titled, "Students Are Better Off Without Distractions in the Classroom." Though I suppose, it wouldn't make a very catchy headline. I found my laptop to be very beneficial in my classroom learning during college, but only when I m…

> I realize my experience is anecdotal FWIW I'm not totally convinced that the paper isn't also anecdotal. They selected for people who would agree to have their internet activity spied on in exchange for extra credit, and then from that group selected only for people using the internet -- not their computers, but the internet! -- in more than half the lectures. And did all of this in a large enrollment undergraduate…

is there really any reason to expect the students who didn't take free points in exchange for privacy to outperform the observed group?

Sure, the results pertain more to excluding the internet from the classroom, but really that's just splitting hairs imo

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#165
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Riiight, because teenagers and young adults are so known for their long-term planning skills and self-control. We're not animals, we don't get born with instincts. This is why humans require education and upbringing to teach. And yes, this ( gasp !) sometimes means you need to make a non-adult person to do something against their first whim.

I don't disagree except for the fact that college students are supposed to be at least semi-adults (though perhaps young and silly ones) and getting through a 50 minute class without giving in to digital temptations is really something that people ought to be capable of well before college.

In fact, it's probably helpful for them to practice that before they have to on the job.

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#166
> First, participants spent almost 40 minutes out of every 100-minute class period using the internet for nonacademic purposes

I think that I'd be one of them; in the absence of a laptop, I'd spend that time daydreaming. How many people can really concentrate through a 100 minute nonstop lecture about differential geometry or the decline of the Majapahit empire?

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#167
post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I opened up a word processor, focused my eyes on the professor's slides or visual aids, and typed everything I saw There are studies that show that verbatim computer note taking is actually inferior to remembering the lecture content: A Learning Secret: Don’t Take Notes with a Laptop https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/a-learning-secret...

I took a two pass approach: hand written notes (I can write equations faster than I can LaTeX them) and then follow up by writing a LaTeX document for each lecture. I had a rule that I wasn't allowed to continue typing up until I understood how each step in the derivation was made. If it was non-obvious, I'd write textbook-style comments around things to explain how to get from line to the next. Worked pretty well fo…

You typeset all your lecture notes? I'm not sure this would benefit a student. Something I wish I did when I was in school is download the solutions manuals and work problems. I considered that cheating when I was in school but now I think it is just being time effective.

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#168
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slowing down to a pace comfortable for you means, at least in my classes, that you'll miss the next thing in the presentation. Notes are not for immediate learning, they're for assisting in learning later on. As an physics engineering student, I take notes with a combination of LaTeX and OneNote on my Surface 3. Additional benefits by using a laptop to take notes is that they are searchable, archived and accessible f…

Can you really write LaTeX equations fast enough to keep up with the lecture? I'm impressed. When I was in school I was often hard pressed to keep up with simple paper and pencil.

Seems like an exaggeration. I really doubt there's anyone taking realtime notes in LaTeX.

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#169
post #91

Oh, okay, I thought the study was going to be on the benefits of attempting to use the laptop itself for classroom purposes, not for social media distractions. This would be more accurately titled, "Students Are Better Off Without Distractions in the Classroom." Though I suppose, it wouldn't make a very catchy headline. I found my laptop to be very beneficial in my classroom learning during college, but only when I m…

Speaking of inaccurate headlines: I know I was better off with a TI-85 in math class, so students don't necessarily have a problem with a computing device itself in a classroom environment as the headline would suggest.

You'd probably be better off with something like a casio fx-115es plus (non graphing scientific calculator). For example: You'd have to remember your integration tables better on not rely on the graphing functions to pull you out of the bog.

Re: Students Are Better Off Without a Laptop in the Classroom

#170
I'll give you no laptops in the class if you give me no standardized testing and only four 15-20 minute lectures per day and let the kids work on projects the rest of the time as a way to prove their learning and experiences in a more tangible way.

Trying to fix the problem by applying only patches, as us technically inclined would say, always leads to horribly unreliable and broken systems.

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