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Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

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Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#131

Post by mc32 »

crush-n-spread wrote: post #101
ithinkinstereo wrote: post #96

It's 10x sad because she's an Asian female (most of the victims are either Asian or another minority group). Unfortunately there is a lot of self-hating and white-is-right mentality among Asians. Why do you think so many westerners goto Asia to "teach" English? Edit: this is an un-PC opinion and casting a wide net, so downvote all you want, but this is well documented and discussed online. And if you've traveled thro…

Why do you think so many westerners goto Asia to "teach" English? I think they go there mostly to experience a culture totally foreign to them. The food and lifestyle is cheap, it's very beautiful, and quite safe.

Moreover it's not only westerners (or only men) who go teach over there. I see people teach English (and to lesser degree other languages) who are not white [diff people from Africa, South America, etc.,] who teach English --moreover, those teachers typically stay in a country a year or two and return home or go onto another country and region; inexplicably, there seem to be an overrepresentation of Canadians. Many of them take the job because it pays relatively better than the alternative back home.

Do _some_ suffer from some fetishism[1], I'm sure --but in my estimation, it's not many.

[1] Charisma Man speaks to the stereotypical western geek who suddenly finds himself attractive in a different culture trope.

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#132

Post by justasitsounds »

backpropaganda wrote: post #75
justasitsounds wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the women in this locker room regularly pressure their juniors into having sex with them? I don't get the equivalence here. Sure, women talk dirty too, rather less of them are guilty of sexual coercion and assault then their male counterparts, I would hazard

Women locker room talk is not about sexual coercion but it's often about using their sexuality to gain advantage. While this is obviously not equivalent to sexual assault, it's not ethical either.

When your worth is defined solely by how horny you make the opposite sex then I wouldn't blame you for trying to game the system

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#133

Post by jaggederest »

at-fates-hands wrote: post #108
ithinkinstereo wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enough to keep on doing it year after year after year.

Which is the part that puzzles me. Successful guy, plenty of money. Get a high priced call girl, go on a sex site and get a woman who wants what you want. I mean I used to be in a band and it was easy to have a woman in nearly every city you could call when you feel lonely. If he was after something deeper, hire a dating consultant and find something worthwhile. It just amazes me that people who have both the means a…

> Get a high priced call girl, go on a sex site and get a woman who wants what you want. I mean I used to be in a band and it was easy to have a woman in nearly every city you could call when you feel lonely.

That's not the point. The point is precisely the power and coercion. Paying someone or finding someone like-minded doesn't hit that button anywhere near the same way that assault and blackmail does.

If you're strong-arming women into sex, it's not about the sex, it's about the strong-arming. The very inappropriateness itself is the goal.

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#134

Post by afeezaziz »

jacquesm wrote: post #40
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #9

" It’s not just inappropriate, it’s assault. " I'm going to have to stop reading there. Now, of course, I don't know what happened, I wasn't there. What I'm seeing in front of me are glowing pixels that don't constitute a conviction. In my opinion if you believe you've been the subject of assault you ought to approach the police, or probably a lawyer.

Good luck as a foreigner in Malaysia approaching the local police to file a complaint for assault based on a forced kiss against another foreigner who happens to be a millionaire. But that doesn't make it right. Note that it is extremely hard to get these cases to go anywhere in the West where you know the law and where the lines tend to be drawn rather sharper than in Asia (unless there is drugs involved).

I do not believe that Malaysian police take a laidback attitude to sexual assault reports sd you have implied here. Even cases of a woman being sexually assaulted by another woman is also taken seriously in Malaysia. I think you need to stop having preconceived ideas about South East Asian countries. They might look similar but they are not.

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#135

Post by DanBC »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #91
jacquesm wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you tell someone to leave (NOW!) after they indicate they want to sleep in your bedroom when they've been offered the couch and then they forcibly kiss you that is in fact sexual assault, in fact even if none of the former had happened it would still be sexual assault. Force => assault. When someone has sex with another person without their permission it is rape .

> and then they forcibly kiss you that is in fact sexual assault, in fact even if none of the former had happened it would still be sexual assault. Force => assault. The US Justice Department doesn't construe a forced kiss as sexual assault: https://www.justice.gov/ovw/sexual-assault "Sexual assault is any type of sexual contact or behavior that occurs without the explicit consent of the recipient. Falling under the…

If you're going to toss out legal language you might want to learn the difference between "battery" (contact happened) and "assault" (no contact required).

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#136

Post by jacquesm »

justasitsounds wrote: post #132
backpropaganda wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Women locker room talk is not about sexual coercion but it's often about using their sexuality to gain advantage. While this is obviously not equivalent to sexual assault, it's not ethical either.

When your worth is defined solely by how horny you make the opposite sex then I wouldn't blame you for trying to game the system

> When your worth is defined solely by how horny you make the opposite sex then I wouldn't blame you for trying to game the system

Sorry?

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#137

Post by toomuchtodo »

dang wrote: post #112
ithinkinstereo wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because there are tons of apologists in the valley. Men who also harass women like McClure and feel they're entitled to it, especially against women of color.

The overwhelming majority of HN votes don't come from "the valley". And to the extent we have data on this the geographical trend is probably opposite to what you're suggesting.

Thanks for "pulling back the curtain" and giving us a peek at the data.

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#138

Post by SwellJoe »

jacquesm wrote: post #119
SwellJoe wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, it's not an abuser's place to decide for their victim what details are made public. But, the direct apology to a victim should be clear and not place blame on them for how they interpreted a situation, "I'm sorry if you felt X" is the opposite of an apology, it is redirecting blame.

Direct aplogies to victims are addressed to those victims, they do not tend to be written as open letters for the world to read and don't usually attempt to whitewash the situation in which the encounter took place so the perpetrator looks better. If he'd left that part out it would be a lot better, if he left out the self congratulatory bits it would look better still. If that had been the only case then the book co…

Oh, I agree with you on that. It's just easy for there to be a lookie-loo sort of situation where people want to know the sordid details and end up re-centering the narrative on the abuser and the story they want to tell.

McClure's public apology, above all, should have been honest and sincere; more detail isn't strictly necessary, to be honest and sincere. It sounds like it wasn't honest or quite sincere. And, it sounds like his private apology, in this case, was decidedly dishonest and redirected blame.

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#139

Post by olleromam91 »

jacquesm wrote: post #89
_wmd wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm by no means a burly red-blooded gentleman, but I can't think of any example from my previous relationships that did not start with either myself or the other making a move which could later have been construed as assault. Of course adding context to all those situations, it's easy to see that I or the recipient would in all probability welcome the advance, and so it is not assault, however the fine line between "…

> Asking for a written legal waiver before planting a kiss on someone you're passionate about seems essentially where all this is leading, and I really can't stand the thought of that. You won't need a written legal waiver, you could simply ask if it is ok. If you don't ask you're taking your chances that the other person reads the situation just like you do. Just yesterday a friend of mine ended up in an elevator wi…

I think the written legal waiver was mentioned because it would be the only verifiable evidence to defend yourself against someone claiming such advances were unwarranted.

Re: Shedding Light on the “Black Box of Inappropriateness”

#140

Post by angry-hacker »

dang wrote: post #99
crispytx wrote: post #12

If you invite someone over to your apartment to drink scotch, and then they come on to you, that's not sexual assault. Sexual assault is when someone has sex with another person without their permission.

You've crossed way over the line into trolling. Since you don't appear to have a history of doing this on HN we haven't banned you, but if you don't stop, we will. It's one thing to bring up real questions and/or complexities of the broader issues—people have been doing that a lot in these threads recently. The timing for that hasn't necessarily been good but one can at least see how it might come up in good faith. O…

Burn in hell hypocrite, I will publish the details of your sins soon.
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