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McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

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Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#41
post #2

The one person that I would have never suspected is Dave McClure. Here's a guy who didn't fit the investment world and he was smart and hustled his way in. He started 500 startups with a female co-founder and said he chose her because she was smarter. He saw an opening for himself and talked about playing Moneyball for venture capital. He spoke often in interviews about chasing investments among founders who didn't f…

You are making a statement of surprise that someone who "didn't fit the investment world", who was "smart" and a "hustler" would not make such a mistake while navigating the interface between his personal life and his business/career. I say "personal life" given these advances indicate an IMPROPER blurring of personal need, including a physical attraction response, which was then carried over into day-to-day business. It is this response that creates a double bind for the women who are involved in situation. Double binds are bad news, whether they are intentional, such as those used by Trump, or unintentional, such as those created by those who do not manage their personal lives well.

Why is it that we EVER may assume, by someone's external behaviors including their writings, videos and interviews, that we may "know" an individual? Why would we ever assume a level of trust in how they conduct themselves in their personal lives by their outward actions? Why would we assume someone who did "fit" the investment world would be more likely to act in a similar improper manner? How is it that we actually fail to acknowledge that each of us has a line that, when it is crossed, we are capable of making horrible mistakes? Why is it that Western culture has formed a view of mistakes as something to be avoided at all cost, as opposed to an opportunity for great learning?

I came out of my self-imposed exile here to post this because I think it's important to draw a line and indicate a social community such as HN (or Twitter) are woefully inadequate to deal with these types of issues in a meaningful way and to do so without a highly divisive conversation forming. (This is not to say the message should not be delivered strongly to anyone listening, however.) All that comes of these discussions is blame and division. Evidence of that is show here, now, in the polarized comments.

The only people who can judge Dave honestly here now are the victims, his co-workers and himself. I do have empathy for those involved, but my emotional contributions here are pointless, given the scale and reach of this news.

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Raping someone is fucked up. I don't see how that sentence is fucked up. If someone said that to me, I would take it as a compliment. To me it says not only are you smart enough to be hired, you're also attractive. Is it better to split it up into two separate sentences? Obviously the guy is hitting on her, if she's not interested then that's fine. I really don't see the problem, could someone please explain?

Seriously, I think "Always Sunny" explains it best (i.e., because of "the implication") https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yUafzOXHPE

Yeah, I immediately thought of that video when I was considering the massive power imbalance at play here.

You can re-word most of Dennis' dialogue to fit the situation, too. "The implication that [she won't get an investment] if she refuses to sleep with me."

The last part of that clip is especially applicable. The other commenter sees this as a compliment. "She's attractive; of course she'd get hit on!" But it's a "compliment" with an asterisk attached to it, and the subtext is a massive power imbalance.

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#43
post #2

The one person that I would have never suspected is Dave McClure. Here's a guy who didn't fit the investment world and he was smart and hustled his way in. He started 500 startups with a female co-founder and said he chose her because she was smarter. He saw an opening for himself and talked about playing Moneyball for venture capital. He spoke often in interviews about chasing investments among founders who didn't f…

I'm not sure what McClure actually did, but in the current hypersensitive, politically correct environment, simply asking a woman out that you happen to meet while both of you are involved with a startup seems to be considered "harassment" worthy of destroying careers and businesses. Some of the stories that have surfaced recently clearly step over the line, but many others are vague and lack any clear intent on the…

It's the position of power, regardless of intent, that's the problem. It's lonely to be the boss. Don't hit on women you meet in that capacity.

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#45
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there are both 1) sleezeballs who intentionally take advantage of their position and 2) men who don't realized what they're doing and need to use better judgement. Without knowing details, there are at least indications in both McClure's and Sacca's pasts that they may (hopefully) be in the latter group. And hopefully this will help both groups get smaller.

Uhmmm..... "In 2014, Sarah Kunst, 31, an entrepreneur, said she discussed a potential job at 500 Startups, a start-up incubator in San Francisco. During the recruiting process, Mr. McClure, a founder of 500 Startups and an investor, sent her a Facebook message that read in part, “I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.”"

Is this sexual harassment? It sounds like calling a party where the food is bad "literally Auschwitz".

Reverse the genders. Is this still sexual harassment? If not, then this isn't sexual harassment either.

I still think this is in poor taste. The attempts to defend it is worse. However, let us commit to refraining from calling it sexual harassment until it is sexual harassment. Calling this sexual harassment is like spitting in the face of all the victims of sexual harassment.

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#46
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhmmm..... "In 2014, Sarah Kunst, 31, an entrepreneur, said she discussed a potential job at 500 Startups, a start-up incubator in San Francisco. During the recruiting process, Mr. McClure, a founder of 500 Startups and an investor, sent her a Facebook message that read in part, “I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.”"

Is this sexual harassment? It sounds like calling a party where the food is bad "literally Auschwitz". Reverse the genders. Is this still sexual harassment? If not, then this isn't sexual harassment either. I still think this is in poor taste. The attempts to defend it is worse. However, let us commit to refraining from calling it sexual harassment until it is sexual harassment. Calling this sexual harassment is like…

No, this is clear sexual harassment, and would be if the genders were reversed, or the same, or entirely unknown. It's a sexual proposition from someone with power over another person in a professional relationship.

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what McClure actually did, but in the current hypersensitive, politically correct environment, simply asking a woman out that you happen to meet while both of you are involved with a startup seems to be considered "harassment" worthy of destroying careers and businesses. Some of the stories that have surfaced recently clearly step over the line, but many others are vague and lack any clear intent on the…

It's the position of power, regardless of intent, that's the problem. It's lonely to be the boss. Don't hit on women you meet in that capacity.

Melinda Gates worked at Microsoft when she met Bill. Should he be publicly tarred and feathered like this? By your logic, he abused his authority and he should not have dated or married his wife because he held power over her - he could have immediately fired her if she had rejected his advances.

So where do we draw the line, and why isn't Bill on the firing line in the same way these others are?

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#48
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhmmm..... "In 2014, Sarah Kunst, 31, an entrepreneur, said she discussed a potential job at 500 Startups, a start-up incubator in San Francisco. During the recruiting process, Mr. McClure, a founder of 500 Startups and an investor, sent her a Facebook message that read in part, “I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.”"

Is this sexual harassment? It sounds like calling a party where the food is bad "literally Auschwitz". Reverse the genders. Is this still sexual harassment? If not, then this isn't sexual harassment either. I still think this is in poor taste. The attempts to defend it is worse. However, let us commit to refraining from calling it sexual harassment until it is sexual harassment. Calling this sexual harassment is like…

Yes, it is still harassment with the genders reversed. What would make you think otherwise?

But that's not actually the bar. It's important to recognize that men and women don't come in on equal footing for these interactions.

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#49
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhmmm..... "In 2014, Sarah Kunst, 31, an entrepreneur, said she discussed a potential job at 500 Startups, a start-up incubator in San Francisco. During the recruiting process, Mr. McClure, a founder of 500 Startups and an investor, sent her a Facebook message that read in part, “I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.”"

Is this sexual harassment? It sounds like calling a party where the food is bad "literally Auschwitz". Reverse the genders. Is this still sexual harassment? If not, then this isn't sexual harassment either. I still think this is in poor taste. The attempts to defend it is worse. However, let us commit to refraining from calling it sexual harassment until it is sexual harassment. Calling this sexual harassment is like…

I mean if we're going to debate labels: In my opinion it is completely inappropriate when your position of power, in a person setting, while referencing the professional setting, to discuss this. Maybe we could use the labels "abusive" or "predatory" or "toxic" if you'd prefer? Personally, I'm fine with "sexually harassive".

Re: McClure steps back at 500Startups after internal sexual misconduct investigation

#50
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhmmm..... "In 2014, Sarah Kunst, 31, an entrepreneur, said she discussed a potential job at 500 Startups, a start-up incubator in San Francisco. During the recruiting process, Mr. McClure, a founder of 500 Startups and an investor, sent her a Facebook message that read in part, “I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.”"

Is this sexual harassment? It sounds like calling a party where the food is bad "literally Auschwitz". Reverse the genders. Is this still sexual harassment? If not, then this isn't sexual harassment either. I still think this is in poor taste. The attempts to defend it is worse. However, let us commit to refraining from calling it sexual harassment until it is sexual harassment. Calling this sexual harassment is like…

I think this is much more serious that you are making it sound if I'm reading your post correctly. As a potential investor you are in a position of power. Depending how things are going it might be a very serious power imbalance. The person seeking funding might feel very compelled to in essence prostitute themselves.
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