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Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

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Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#151

I think there is some interesting middle ground where you could use machine learning to go from 'show only relevant ads' to 'show only ads you might actually click on with greater than .001 probability'. I guess this is like 'extreme' outlier detection but it'd be interesting to see what revenue the ads at the 'long tail' of likelihood generate anyway. My guess the bulk of it is from the standard high CPC stuff like…

"Consumer Gmail content will not be used or scanned for any ads personalization after this change."

Original post: https://blog.google/products/gmail/g-suite-gains-traction-in...

Disclaimer: I work for Google, but not on this.

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#152
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, you can buy some paint that blocks all RF signals. It's absurdly expensive but quite effective. There aren't many ways to get signals out of a room painted with the stuff. If you're thinking "Why not just build a faraday cage?" then you're thinking the right thing.

Actually RF shielding paint is very poor. Manufacturers advertise them with "99.5 %" or so, which equates a measly 20 dB. Additionally, correctly applying these is quite difficult, and incorrect application greatly diminishes the shielding. (You also need to cover everything, including ceiling and floor, not just the walls). Even when correctly applied, the attenuation is so weak, a cell phone will still work. Shield…

> RF dead chambers are bloody expensive for a reason: you can't emulate them by pasting some paint on a wall.

Couldn't you just stick yourself in a metal box (with a metal door that is careful to get a good seal)?

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#153

I think there is some interesting middle ground where you could use machine learning to go from 'show only relevant ads' to 'show only ads you might actually click on with greater than .001 probability'. I guess this is like 'extreme' outlier detection but it'd be interesting to see what revenue the ads at the 'long tail' of likelihood generate anyway. My guess the bulk of it is from the standard high CPC stuff like…

> Paying Gmail users never received the email-scanning ads like the free version of the program, but some business customers were confused by the distinction and its privacy implications, said Diane Greene, Google’s senior vice president of cloud.

Google doesn't read e-mails from GSuite. So the change is to stop reading from Gmail's free accounts.

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#154
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more like your accountant preparing your tax return for free in exchange for aggregating data about your receipts and offering you goods and services you may be interested in.

how about: my accountant preparing my tax return for free in exchange for... inviting ...a sleazy salesman [to] sneak a peek at them and find new ways to sell me stuff.

That's not very accurate. It's more like:

Your accountant prepares your tax return for free. They also have a lot of boxes of flyers provided to them by people who want to sell things. After preparing your tax return, they use their knowledge of your return to choose which flyer to put into the envelope. They then send that envelope back to you, and when you open it to read your tax return, there's a flyer for something else paperclipped to the front with a note saying "Thought you might find this interesting."

(In particular, the accountant is only one who sees the information in your tax return.)

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#155
post #145
post #33

I never understood the argument that some automatic scanning for keywords is like "reading" your mail. By that same logic isn't Gmail's spam filter still "reading" your mail? It is classifying your mail based on content after all...

Does the automated nature of the permanent data collection change anything? How about an automated drone with a camera mounted on it that follows you everywhere and records every action, indefinitely, purely automated ofcource, so that an advertising company can helpfully remind you about the awesome great $6 lunch menu when you walk past McBurger at lunchtime, or about picking up some hemorrhoids cream from MediCo b…

Depends. Is that drone providing me with some other useful service, or is it following me around entirely without my knowledge or consent?

Gmail provides me with a free email service. They already have the full text of all my emails. If they want to use that data to help decide what ads to serve me, I have no problem with that so long as that data isn't shared with anyone else without my consent.

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#156
post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The value of this model is more than the cost of them doing your tax returns It's likely the value Google got out of scanning your email wasn't worth that much in terms of modelling profiles for ads. Probably because having both your search history and "anonymized" Google analytics, plus the sea of data that comes from owning Android is more than enough data that Google/Doubleclick needs. From a purely capitalist p…

Eh? That assumption of "not associating my personal identity" doesn't actually work. Your profile IS your personal identity, and can be associated trivially. If not algorithmically, then via one connecting piece of information supplied by various databases and no such agencies. You're living in a dream.

> Your profile IS your personal identity, and can be associated trivially.

I'm hardly new to his stuff and to say it's trivial is nonsense. Most people make it trivial but it's not trivial to associate identities of people who put basic effort into obscuring them.

Merely disconnecting your primary profiles from your online activity is enough to throw most mass-surveillance/drag-net stuff off, aka 99.9% of advertising firms and most government programs.

If you're an activist or someone interested in keeping your internet activity private then the bar is far higher (and the targets of which are ever expanding as governments and private organizations get better at this stuff). FBI agents, or likewise in your country of residence, have plenty of forensic tools at their disposal to connect disparate identities. It takes some real time investment and requires being super careful to evade these measures. But I'm not talking about that here. I mean the average person in 2017.

I've personally done the total anonymity stuff as an experiment so I know what that takes.

Having studied many documents from the various global national security organizations and being fortunate to have dated a defense attorney in the past who engaged with police surveillance reports on a daily basis for their work I'm convinced that even basic privacy measures such as never using your real identity when using internet services, creating full legitimate sounding backstories (and subsequent online profiles) for your fake identity, and changing the ID you use often enough will throw off most basic surveillance measures.

I'm not doing anything to get people really invested in uncovering my online identities, as most people aren't, which is what I'm talking about.

The simple fact is the vast, vast majority of people reuse the same username (and passwords) across the internet and use their real name and emails everywhere. So it's really not hard to track people online from an LEO or 4chan doxxing perspective.

But I'm not convinced you have to be isolated from the utility of most online (cloud) services. You just have to invest in using them intelligently to not associate your actual identity with the services.

Ad companies aren't interested in deanonymizing people anyway. They are looking for low hanging fruit and there are more than enough people to fill databases who fit this profile. So I'm not that concerned about those who don't.

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#157
post #107
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more like your accountant preparing your tax return for free in exchange for aggregating data about your receipts and offering you goods and services you may be interested in.

Let's split the difference. It's like your accountant preparing your tax return in exchange for using that tax return to develop a model of your spending habits. The value of this model is more than the cost of them doing your tax returns, and in fact is such that if you were simply to collect that data yourself, sell it on the open market, and spend a portion of the proceeds on the tax prep service, you would end up…

> if you were simply to collect that data yourself, sell it on the open market, and spend a portion of the proceeds on the tax prep service, you would end up with profit, and the tax prep service would still exist.

Economies of scale; the market for that data would not exist if individuals collected it themselves to sell. Hence would break down.

Phrased another way; this data about 1 person is relatively valueless.

(I like the rest of your example BTW; just disagree with your conclusion)

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It says it's exempt from ads in this specific context, but is it actually free of their data mining? If they still use the data to track and push whatever they're selling you in other contexts, the presence of the ads themselves is an ancillary concern.

According to the article it is.

Right, I read it. But it's still not actually clear to me whether they are ceasing ALL mining of email data for business accounts, or are just not funneling it to a specific set of ad programs. To me, at least, that seems an important point of clarification.

Re: Google Will Stop Reading Your Emails for Gmail Ads

#159
post #33

I never understood the argument that some automatic scanning for keywords is like "reading" your mail. By that same logic isn't Gmail's spam filter still "reading" your mail? It is classifying your mail based on content after all...

And yet everyone's up in arms if GCHQ / NSA does it.
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