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Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

technologyreview.com

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Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#31

Post by _red »

jlaskdf768 wrote: post #15
meesterdude wrote: post #10

This is a pretty ironic statement, given their entire product design is built to serve apple, and the users are often secondary to that or ignored entirely; such as making UI more difficult on purpose so you're more inclined to use siri, or buying music instead of bringing your own. I dont see AI at apple being any different. Its for them FIRST, us second, if at all. "humanity" may as well mean corporations since the…

This smells more like you're frustrated with "business as usual" these days and less Apple specifically. Every org I have been with has had to maintain a level of "can't resolve 100% of the numerous customer complaints, because gotta ship." Can't Tim be pointing to a path forward? Why so negative. If they can't fix it all today, they're not good at their work, and completely incompetent?

I'm sympathetic to that idea and feel like it could potentially hold a lot of weight, yet Tim did turn the tech juggernaut he was bequeathed into a watch band and sticker company.

Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#33

Post by euyyn »

metaphorm wrote: post #7

more context for the headline quote. FTA: "While he calls AI “profound” and increasingly capable of doing unbelievable things, on matters that require judgment he’s not comfortable with automating the human entirely out of the equation. “When technological advancement can go up so exponentially I do think there’s a risk of losing sight of the fact that tech should serve humanity, not the other way around.” he's talki…

> there’s a risk of losing sight of the fact that tech should serve humanity, not the other way around

Whoever thinks for even a moment that humanity should serve technology?

Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#34

Post by askafriend »

_red wrote: post #31
jlaskdf768 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This smells more like you're frustrated with "business as usual" these days and less Apple specifically. Every org I have been with has had to maintain a level of "can't resolve 100% of the numerous customer complaints, because gotta ship." Can't Tim be pointing to a path forward? Why so negative. If they can't fix it all today, they're not good at their work, and completely incompetent?

I'm sympathetic to that idea and feel like it could potentially hold a lot of weight, yet Tim did turn the tech juggernaut he was bequeathed into a watch band and sticker company.

> yet Tim did turn the tech juggernaut he was bequeathed into a watch band and sticker company.

That's such an incredibly simplistic view of Apple's strategy. I expected more out of the HN crowd.

I honestly think the moderation team should crack down more on these types of casual and innocuous statements that provide no value that they might as well be memes.

It's so incredibly easy to trivialize anything, especially when you don't understand it - and you see this happening more as a forum or subreddit grows bigger and the audience gets broader and less informed.

It's frustrating to say the least because instead of an actually interesting conversation, we're left with this drivel which isn't even fun to respond to or even entertain as a thought.

Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#35

Post by soperj »

eridius wrote: post #28
meesterdude wrote: post #10

This is a pretty ironic statement, given their entire product design is built to serve apple, and the users are often secondary to that or ignored entirely; such as making UI more difficult on purpose so you're more inclined to use siri, or buying music instead of bringing your own. I dont see AI at apple being any different. Its for them FIRST, us second, if at all. "humanity" may as well mean corporations since the…

> given their entire product design is built to serve apple, and the users are often secondary to that or ignored entirely; such as making UI more difficult on purpose so you're more inclined to use siri, or buying music instead of bringing your own. That's simply not true, and it's a really offensive statement for pretty much anybody working at Apple. There's no company I can think of that cares more about the user…

Apple is extremely user-hostile, they make it hard to do anything they don't want you to do with YOUR device. It's simple things like using uncommon screws internally, or soldering in the ram, or requiring a certain set of bits at the front of your hard drive, or making it so the batteries cannot be removed.

Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#36

Post by federal »

mikestew wrote: post #14
federal wrote: post #2

So is he going to lobby for a massive overhaul of Foxconn's employment practices?

From your reading of the article, is that within the context of what the article was referencing? Because I'm reading nothing that indicates to me that the conversation/interview had anything to do with manufacturing or employment practices. Additionally, I would argue that "employment practices" have little or nothing to do with "technology".

That's a fair point - the article pretty clearly has a different focus than what I was alluding to. My point is more that if Tim Cook is going to make these sort of surface level musings about how AI/tech will need to remain tools of humans I think it's important for him to realize that ultimately there are still humans who are tools of other humans. Also I personally think that 'technology' permeates and oozes into nearly all aspects of our lives at this point. I think you're correct in that strictly domain knowledge regarding technology wouldn't involve discussing employment practices; however, real world applications of tech very much so involves a discussion of employment practices. When Cook makes comments that "he’s not comfortable with automating the human entirely out of the equation." -- I understand he's focusing on the integration of AI into human systems but I'd be more than willing to bet that he is perfectly comfortable with automating the labor out of the equation - and therefore a human out of the equation - by cutting costs through a fully automated production line.

Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#37

Post by soperj »

ChrisLTD wrote: post #20
chollida1 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's easy. The most common thing to do with my iPHone is hit the button. They overloaded the button to load Siri if its held for even a fraction of a second too long. 99 times out of 100 I don't want to use siri but she continually pops up. Trying to click to get back to the home screen.... here's Siri. Trying to double click the button, to kill an app..... here comes Siri So to answer the question.... 1) They made…

I'm sure being able to access Siri from a prominent button was boon to users that have little or no eye sight. Also, recall this was added to iPhones before any other major phone had similar built-in functionality.

I have the google assistant on my galaxy s3, stock.

Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#38

Post by gnaritas »

soperj wrote: post #35
eridius wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> given their entire product design is built to serve apple, and the users are often secondary to that or ignored entirely; such as making UI more difficult on purpose so you're more inclined to use siri, or buying music instead of bringing your own. That's simply not true, and it's a really offensive statement for pretty much anybody working at Apple. There's no company I can think of that cares more about the user…

Apple is extremely user-hostile, they make it hard to do anything they don't want you to do with YOUR device. It's simple things like using uncommon screws internally, or soldering in the ram, or requiring a certain set of bits at the front of your hard drive, or making it so the batteries cannot be removed.

That's not user hostile, that's user friendly, those things enable them to delivery a standard experience (something you cannot get on a droid) on their appliance to users who by the way love the shit out of them for how well their phones work. You might not like Apple, but their users do precisely because of those things. Apple sees their phones as appliances, not as personal computers to be customized; that approach has earned them die hard loyal fans who love those appliances as is. We don't all want to hack our phones, I'll take an iPhone over a droid any day, it's a much better experience.

Re: Tim Cook: Technology Should Serve Humanity, Not the Other Way Around

#39

Post by jly »

glhaynes wrote: post #8
federal wrote: post #2

So is he going to lobby for a massive overhaul of Foxconn's employment practices?

Presumably he'd point you toward https://www.apple.com/supplier-responsibility/ , especially the "2017 Progress Report" toward the top of that page. Edit: I don't post that to defend Cook/Apple, just to point out that Apple has done quite a bit of talking about this topic since the bad old days when they really did need to make some changes. Have they done "enough"? I have no idea, and would love to hear someone know…

I opened this up just for fun. I'll start by saying I do think Apple is doing quite a bit in this regard and are pushing things forward towards better working conditions. Having said that, what is still considered "acceptable" and worthy of touting is pretty sad, although I guess it is compared with where we they were just a few years ago.

Flipping to page 9, they list 98% compliance with international working hours limits, touting "Full-time doesn't mean you should work all the time." Compliant in this case is a 60-hour workweek with 1 day off every 7 days (presumably this is not an occasional duration but rather a normal week at a fixed wage). If this is the case, technology sure isn't serving these unlucky humans very well.

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