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“Let her speak please”

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Re: “Let her speak please”

#491

Post by gknoy »

logfromblammo wrote: post #382
jasonshen wrote: post #11

Edit: I watched the video. The moderator goes on and on and the "let her speak please" sounds very polite. This is a painfully frustrating reminder that women get talked over by men. It's one thing to have one panelist talk over another, but to have the moderator, who is explicitly in charge of facilitating a panel discussion, be the one to drown out a panelist is just unacceptable. Yes, "not all men" do this, but th…

I get talked over all the time. I usually chalk it up to being an American living in America, but with a more Scandinavian/Minnesotan conversational style. That is, I will pause while speaking, spooling my next thought out to the phonological loop, to review and filter it, before streaming it out through the voice apparatus, but then some jackass will use that break to assume conversational priority when I haven't yi…

I realize this sounds silly, but maybe having a conch, or similar talisman of "I'm not done yet, please listen" might be handy.

I find myself interrupting my children a lot more than I like (and while it often feels like it's because they're interrupting me as well, I'm certain that's usually not true). Having a stuffed animal or similar "conch" talisman might help us actually listen, because each of us could point out who has the conch.

Re: “Let her speak please”

#492

Post by devmunchies »

ethbro wrote: post #248
roberto wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't find the study, but men interrupt women much more than they interrupt men. Also, women interrupt other women more than they interrupt men as well.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/lexicon_valley/2014/07/23/study_m... Men are 3x as likely to interrupt women. Women will interrupt women, but rarely men. Informal study, but decent sample size.

If men are 3x as likely to interrupt women, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for their more assertive tendencies?

Re: “Let her speak please”

#493

Post by rach-face »

dragonwriter wrote: post #461
turc1656 wrote: post #457

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonsense. By your statement, the reason it disproportionately impacts women is not because of some rudimentary, fundamental reason but rather because they fail to react the same way the men did and speak up. That lies 100% on the women. In fact what YOU wrote is actually sexist, since it suggests that the corrective action would be to act differently toward her, but not the men. Perhaps you might merely argue that he…

> By your statement, the reason it disproportionately impacts women is not because of some rudimentary, fundamental reason but rather because they fail to react the same way the men did and speak up. That lies 100% on the women. No, the effects of deliberate, targeted differences in socialization by gender aren't the fault of the people experiencing adverse impacts because of the intersection of those with social str…

get real.

Re: “Let her speak please”

#494

Post by hosh »

oneoff_147 wrote: post #96
lawik wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you believe that it is as common? Do you believe that the person you are replying to doesn't believe that it ever happens? Does excluding a full disclaimer invalidate his thoughts about trying not to talk over women or dominating conversations? I don't believe it is always necessary to counter-exemplify what you experience as a general trend.

My personal experience, especially through family and to a lesser extent through other acquaintances, is of women dominating conversations and talking over men. I (a man) can't tell you how many times I've had a woman ask me a question and then talk over my answer, or repeatedly interrupt me when I try to participate in a conversation. And I see the same thing happening to other men I know. The men just kind of give…

Eisler brings up that frame in "The Chalice and the Blade" -- it was often assumed in historical scholarship that non-patriarchial societies were matriarchial. Instead, she reframes it as "dominator" vs. "cooperator" societies. In other words, wrestling over which gender has dominance is not as helpful as shifting over towards cooperation in general.

Re: “Let her speak please”

#496

Post by 23inhouse »

This video is great. I'm glad I watched it and as soon as I finish writing this I'll be looking for more like it.

"Let her speak please", there are some many things wrong with this, starting with live tweeting this panel's discussion.

Just watch the video! There are so many more interesting and inspiring things to discuss. Listen to what they are saying. They are talking about the nature of reality and if it's possible for us to understand it.

Edit: I just got to the point where the audience member yelled out. What a disgusting display, who do they think they are, they should "check their privilege". This type of forum is not the place for aggressive behaviour like that. It's not good enough.

Re: “Let her speak please”

#497

Post by dang »

anc84 wrote: post #48
humanrebar wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this whole thread about not letting people talk over you? Only listening and not being able to contribute back to what should be a conversation? Everyone has the right to express frustration, I think.

Listen, you don't understand. Feminists are the sole authority of sexism and thus, if someone proclaims themselves as feminist, you better listen and accept their truths. It might be uncomfortable but you are just supporting patriachy and misogyny if you don't stop thinking with your own misguided, sexist brain.

Posting inflammatory comments on divisive topics is trolling. We ban accounts that do that, so please don't do it again.

Others have been doing this in the thread as well, but you've repeatedly posted uncivilly to HN in the past and we've warned you more than once. If you don't want to be banned, you need to fix this.

Re: “Let her speak please”

#498

Post by orbitingpluto »

devmunchies wrote: post #492
ethbro wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/lexicon_valley/2014/07/23/study_m... Men are 3x as likely to interrupt women. Women will interrupt women, but rarely men. Informal study, but decent sample size.

If men are 3x as likely to interrupt women, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for their more assertive tendencies?

If men are 3x as likely to engage in violent behaviour, is it sexism or simply a biological tendency? And if it is a biological tendency, is it not sexist to shame men for their more assertive tendencies?

/sarcasm

Re: “Let her speak please”

#499

Post by dragonwriter »

rach-face wrote: post #493
dragonwriter wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> By your statement, the reason it disproportionately impacts women is not because of some rudimentary, fundamental reason but rather because they fail to react the same way the men did and speak up. That lies 100% on the women. No, the effects of deliberate, targeted differences in socialization by gender aren't the fault of the people experiencing adverse impacts because of the intersection of those with social str…

get real.

In precisely what way is any of what I wrote not real?

Re: “Let her speak please”

#500

Post by cooper12 »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #114
cooper12 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The mere thought that the world isn't a meritocracy frightens techbros. Any word ending in -ism is like a swear word to them. It's a really big problem that no one wants to acknowledge and if you do bring it up suddenly you're an SJW, combative, political, etc... It speaks numbers that in the link so many people had the same thought as the author, but were afraid to speak out. We've successfully stigmatized calling p…

Or the flagging is because these issues are trawled over here regularly and never really go anywhere, and people feel there are already better fora to discuss those issues?

> never really go anywhere

Better to sweep them under the rug and pretend they don't exist then.

> there are already better fora

Such as? This is a tech forum, one of places which currently has a lot of issues with sexism and discrimination. It should be one of the first places addressing it. What's this alternate forum? Somewhere out of sight and out of mind I'm sure. The fact that my comment got flagged is just testament to its veracity.

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