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US quits Paris climate pact

bbc.com

61–70 of 413 posts

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#61
post #37

The United States of America spent a hundred years building up a global leadership position. President Trump has effectively destroyed it in a mere four months. China is adeptly stepping up to fill the void left by the United States. Last week Trump did his best to alienate America's long-standing European allies, who now feel that they are on their own against Russia's expanding European power plays. So Europe is tu…

Why do we need a global leader anymore?

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#63
post #45

Can someone give me pros and cons of this move (serious responses only)? Thanks

The deal is unenforceable, very expensive, and most likely will fail. Also, China emits twice as much greenhouse gas as the United States.

Well, China has more than four times as many citizens.

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#64
I have a cleantech startup, and in the industry we see this decision as only having a negative impact on deep red states. Most other states will implement mandates in line with Paris on their own, which will grow their local energy economies (the transition means lots of jobs).

Deep red states that try to slow the transition will just get left behind. Trump is hurting his own base, while not slowing anyone else down. The economics are simply too good to turn back now.

Happy to answer questions. And many companies in cleantech are hiring!

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#65
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the only way anyone could argue there are any pros is if they could convince me that Trump has a different long-term plan to address climate change. Unfortunately, all of his actions up to this point indicate that he doesn't have any such plan. I really wish people would stop trying to understand and rationalize this man's actions. He has no rational for what he does other than his own short-lived whims and t…

That's a Republican orthodoxy, not just Trump. Climate change either doesn't occur, or if it occurs it's not man made, if it's man made nothing can be done. In any case, doing anything is job killing and anti freedom. I think Trump himself doesn't care.

I don't think anyone argues that it doesn't occur, not even Republicans. The focus is on the extent of man's impact and what should be done about it. From the Republican point of view the alarmists have lost all credibility since about the 70s or 80s.

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#66
post #45

Can someone give me pros and cons of this move (serious responses only)? Thanks

The deal is unenforceable, very expensive, and most likely will fail. Also, China emits twice as much greenhouse gas as the United States.

It's almost like they have more people then the US does? Like about four times as many?

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#67
post #9

Elon Musk just posted that he will, as promised, be quitting the presidential council: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/870369915894546432

If he did not do it, I would have to find a different car producer for my next car. So, I have to think about it. I am not sure, if I want to support US companies in this "America first" situation. A country that so much indulges in egoism is really difficult to like. The US produces Anti-Americanism itself.

I think it is important to distinguish between the US and Trump and his supporters. Musk and Tesla are one of the big driving forces in fighting climate change - the cars are an important step, but long term their storage business might have an even larger impact on moving to renewable energies. So supporting them sounds like a very good idea, especially if you disagree with Trumps climate politics.

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#68

Can someone give me pros and cons of this move (serious responses only)? Thanks

I think the only way anyone could argue there are any pros is if they could convince me that Trump has a different long-term plan to address climate change. Unfortunately, all of his actions up to this point indicate that he doesn't have any such plan. I really wish people would stop trying to understand and rationalize this man's actions. He has no rational for what he does other than his own short-lived whims and t…

Many large corporations have come out against this decision (P&G, Coca Cola, GE, FB, G, 3M, Dow etc). So if he's not doing this because of lobbying from them, why is he doing this? Lobbying from O&G companies? Or is it just pure ignorance?

Re: US quits Paris climate pact

#69
post #37

The United States of America spent a hundred years building up a global leadership position. President Trump has effectively destroyed it in a mere four months. China is adeptly stepping up to fill the void left by the United States. Last week Trump did his best to alienate America's long-standing European allies, who now feel that they are on their own against Russia's expanding European power plays. So Europe is tu…

You're overreacting and falling into what China would love people to believe, that 4 years of bad leadership is equivalent to decades of autocracy.

When Trump is gone in 3 years, it's not gonna be so dire. Stupid short-sighted decision, but it's just a road bump. The Germans and Japanese recovered from WW2, pretty sure the US can recover from Trump.

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