Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

341–350 of 564 posts

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#341

Post by jimmyk »

deong wrote: post #337
kevinnk wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost all of those things are already implemented in the US. > cap individual donations Direct contribution cap for individuals is $2,700 > forbid companies from donating Direct contributions are not allowed, although PACs can give up to $5000. > create a government entity whose goal is to ensure donations are respecting those rules Aka the FEC > candidates having to deliver their list of donors to said entity Alrea…

They're implemented, but the rise of the SuperPAC after Citizens United more or less makes the regulations pointless. I can't contribute more than $2700 to a campaign, but I can contribute $27,000,000 to a PAC that requires only the thinnest imaginable separation from the campaign. Basically, as long as the candidate isn't on TV personally endorsing my check, we're good.

What is your alternative to the Citizens United ruling?

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#342

Post by clarkmoody »

michaelt wrote: post #12

That suggests that U.S. costs are high due to general inefficiency [...] Americans have simply ponied up more and more cash over the years while ignoring the fact that they were getting less and less for their money. There's a general effect in political systems, that if a law takes $20 from 1,000,000 people and gives $100,000 to 200 people, the people who lose money won't have enough incentive to put up a big fight;…

This is a feature of democracy. The solution is not campaign finance reform, it is reform of democracy itself. Place additional separation between the people/corporations and the purse-strings of the treasury, and you will reduce this problem. Alternatively, you can take power & responsibility away from the government so that market forces come to bear upon the issue.

Democracy is, after all, a system in which a determined voting majority can use the hammer of the state to extract wealth from the rest of the population. Many people vote in self-defense.

I know that arguing for smaller government and less democracy is an unpopular position, but it is the only way to achieve long-term success. The areas of the economy with the most government involvement and regulation are where we find costs ballooning out of control: healthcare, prisons, infrastructure, student loans, military. Continuing on the present course is not sustainable.

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#343

Post by watwut »

ShannonAlther wrote: post #318
Mz wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have two sons. At the time that we chose to go carless, we were living in an apartment complex with endless speed bumps. Driving over the speed bumps into and out of the complex daily was about 3 minutes of torture that we were completely thrilled to give up. Humorously, we have had occasion to put me on a bus for some reason while they walked to the destination in question. I would get ahead of them, then the bus…

> Unless you are driving quite a long distance and/or on the open highway, car travel is not as much faster than foot travel as some people seem to believe. The average speed limit on municipal roads in Ontario is 50 km/h, which means that anywhere within 5km will take 6 minutes and, within 10km, 12 minutes. Running 5km takes me 18 minutes, and running 10km takes me closer to 40 minutes. Humans walk at about 5km/h, w…

You are not doing speed limit on average in most cities. You slow down for turns, you wait for red light, you wait for other cars, you are parking. Most importantly, shortcuts available to pedestrians are not available to cars that have to take longer route.

I do groceries by walk and it never took 2 hours. The store is not 5km away pretty much from anywhere. You have to be out of city or in the middle of night for it to be that far. Unless there is some kind of law to prevent it, stores with what you need daily pop up around cities everywhere.

In any case, 5km is still nothing on bicycle which I might take for that distance. Just to kill two birds with one stone and get a bit of exercise.

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#344

Post by specialist »

mason240 wrote: post #177
Mz wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And America's love affair with the automobile is a well-known abusive relationship that America will never have the courage to leave. From what I have read, Millenials are putting noteworthy pressure on this aspect of American culture. Also, I gave up my car years ago. With the magic of the internet, I work online. I mostly walk everywhere and occasionally take public transit. I think we can change this substantially…

You're free to live how you choose, but don't force others to live how you see fit.

Diverting some of the cheddar from highways to public transit is hardly depriving anyone of their cherished way of life.

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#345

Post by TulliusCicero »

watwut wrote: post #332
TulliusCicero wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. America's forced dominance of the automobile is pretty grossly unethical. Freedom means the ability to make meaningful choices, and if biking is incredibly dangerous, transit is slow and infrequent, and nothing is within walking distance, then those are hardly meaningful options, are they? Building to support multiple modes of transportation is the freedom-loving thing to do. Want to walk? Go for it! Transit?…

Biking is not "incredibly dangerous". It plenty safe. It is healthy. It however sometimes slows down cars and some drivers are then motivated to frame biking as dangerous activity to stop it. But really really really, biking is not incredibly dangerous.

Biking in the US is way more dangerous than in countries where it's more popular, like the Netherlands.

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#346

Post by zanny »

phil21 wrote: post #189
mason240 wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're free to live how you choose, but don't force others to live how you see fit.

Exactly. Folks who prefer public transit have been forced to live in car culture by folks who fund roads at the expense of pretty much every other form of transportation. In many cases very unethically so. Due to the societal and environmental effects, I think it's pretty clear roads should be in no way subsidized like they currently are. If the "suburbs" had to carry their full economic costs, they would be unafford…

There have been several great articles that have floated to the top of HN in recent years about how practically no city in the US can afford to maintain its own road networks because of the extreme subsidies in the past.

It is a combination of population density being artificially lowered through cheap road subsidies, constant pressure to eliminate taxes, and gutting alternative transport meaning roads need to satiate all human mobility and thus need huge capacity.

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#347

Post by L_Rahman »

gozur88 wrote: post #269
CodeCube wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If people don't bang on about it, nothing will ever change ... seriously, everyone will simply move on and build the next urban sprawl center, and the next shitty road, out to the next desolate subdivision because that's what's easy. No one wants to be agitated. Well, too bad, we _should_ be agitated. Those without the good fortune _should_ raise hell to the city planners, and attend city council meetings, and vote i…

>If people don't bang on about it, nothing will ever change ... It's not going to change anyway. The car haters on HN are in the minority of Americans.

It's already changing in statistically significant ways:

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2016/01/the-d...

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#348

Post by Gibbon1 »

afuchs wrote: post #252
joshuaheard wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is two problems with this theory. The first is that governments have immunity from litigation. They can only be sued where they consent to the lawsuit. The second is that in most states, employee-related injury claims must proceed through a worker's compensation system outside the normal litigation channel where the costs are much less. I always say there are not too many lawsuits, but too many laws. Legislatur…

The government and its workers are not immune from litigation either, both have been sued, and successfully held responsible for damages. Actual construction is performed by contractors, corporations that are contracted by the government. In the US, it is rare for a construction project to be built, or even be designed, by government workers. These corporations and their workers can be sued, and take on additional li…

Since my dad worked as an engineer for the Federal Government I have skewed ideas how things work compared to most people.

Which is to say, you are spot on. Most of the work government engineers do is oversight. Oversight is really important.

I've constantly read that in the US due to ideological reasons the agencies that handle oversight are chronically understaffed which results in delays and inefficiencies. Delays are a big problem in the US. The slower a project is done the more it costs. Without proper oversight, you have an inability to efficiently manage design changes leading to delays and or less efficient construction.

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#349

Post by hdhdjjdjd7773 »

lghh wrote: post #180
deanCommie wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, having moved to Western Europe, I get the sense that this is the major factor as well. If I walk down the street and there is a group of workers excavating a road, there's a lot more of a relaxed attitude about fencing, walking underneath construction equipment, etc. After all - use your common sense - don't fall into the hole. If you do, isn't it kind of your own fault? Nobody's going to sue anybody. Ad…

> And America's love affair with the automobile is a well-known abusive relationship that America will never have the courage to leave. It's pretty much impossible to leave this relationship unless you live in one of the larger US cities. If you live in a suburb, rural area, or city that's not in the top 10-15 in terms of size there's literally no other option that exists or that could easily exist.

The answer is to build new infra close by in support of those locations!

Oh.

Re: The US has forgotten how to do infrastructure

#350

Post by RodericDay »

mason240 wrote: post #289
CodeCube wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If people don't bang on about it, nothing will ever change ... seriously, everyone will simply move on and build the next urban sprawl center, and the next shitty road, out to the next desolate subdivision because that's what's easy. No one wants to be agitated. Well, too bad, we _should_ be agitated. Those without the good fortune _should_ raise hell to the city planners, and attend city council meetings, and vote i…

I can't wait for electric SDCs. They will be the final nail in the coffin of anti-folks.

What?
Post reply on HN