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Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

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Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#381

Post by hendersoon »

The problem isn't the automatic updates-- Windows always automatically updated. Where Windows 10 changed for the worse is in FORCED reboots.

Once you update, Windows 10 is gonna reboot sooner or later. You can schedule it, but there's nothing you can do to stop it. It's unavoidable. It doesn't care if you're running a long compile, or uploading a large file. If you aren't sitting in front of the computer, it's gonna reboot, period.

I find this to be unacceptable.

The previous behavior, where it essentially nagged you mercilessly until you acquiesced, was far superior. I didn't go out of my way to find a 3rd party program to disable that nag-- I found it useful, to remind me I had to reboot at some point, when I found it convenient to do so.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#382

Post by zanny »

gens wrote: post #76

I wish I could disable updates. Dumb ass win10 thinks it's ok to download 2 GIGABYTES of data. How is it reasonable to have gigabytes of updates ? For security ? I have gigabytes of binaries here ? And then 15 days later, 1.5GB of updates. (note: my win10 laptop is usually used with mobile internet) Win10 is a shame. They could have at least separated security updates from random crap updates. A button would be nice…

Meanwhile, a months worth of Ubuntu LTS updates probably totals around 20MB on average, and 90% of that is kernel deltas.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#383

Post by GhotiFish »

supernovae wrote: post #374
novaleaf wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is the reason why most people (non tech savvy) look to turning off Windows Update. Most people don't know/care about Windows Update pushing features. However most people DO care when their computers spontaneously reboot themselves with no warning (sometimes even in the middle of "active hours"!) which is what msft has set by default (and indeed has/had no UI to modify in some versions of Win10)

This is now fixed.. But inversely, i'm annoyed that this "upgrade phenomena" seems squarely targeted at Microsoft when people who run Linux or OSX upgrade the second new shiny comes out. I'm not ranting here other than expressing a curiosity of culture that leads to cultural problems lingering much longer than they should. Windows 10 is awesome.. the experiment with "ads" sucks but its all tweakable.. just jump to Rs…

I guess in the same way a farmer might listen to its cattle? A nasty disease or two would get fixed, nice food to keep them fed, but if they're telling the farmers "don't eat me" I can't imagine the farmers would be very receptive.

Likewise. Stop spying on me, stop advertising to me, stop pushing products I don't want on me, stop treating my computer like your personal playground.

None of this is going to gain traction. All of those are the point. No amount of listening will fix this.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#384

Post by cartoonfoxes »

Silhouette wrote: post #214
nu5500 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? You're more concerned about the software being provided to you by Microsoft, who is at least presumably trying to keep you as a satisfied customer and provide a secure operating system then you are for faceless hackers connected to the Internet who's whole objective is to either out right steal people's money, disrupt people's lives, or else subvert your computer in order to launch attacks on other users?

You're more concerned about the software being provided to you by Microsoft ... then you are for faceless hackers connected to the Internet Yes. And there is no /s on this comment. We don't use much recent Microsoft software because we no longer trust it. They are going down a path we don't want to follow. With the older OSes that we do still use, principally Windows 7, we are similarly sceptical about updates, and t…

> you might consider that objectively we have had far more downtime as a result of bad updates from Microsoft than as a result of malicious actions by hackers over recent years, and I doubt we're alone in that.

I haven't seen it put that way before. You're not alone.

One of the recent update cycles had some kind of interaction the video drivers on several of my machines, resulting in monitors connected via DisplayPort intermittently failing to wake up following a screen blank. The current workaround is for users to reach around the back of their monitor, unplug and replug the power. I burned an entire day on that one, plus the continued frustration.

Knock on wood, but I can't remember the last time I had to scramble for a security incident or malware outbreak.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#385

Post by ak39 »

pfarnsworth wrote: post #332
CydeWeys wrote: post #4

I love the way he's compared the people who tell you to turn off auto-updates with anti-vaxxers; it's quite an apt analogy. Microsoft shares part of the blame here for pushing features that the user clearly doesn't want through updates (especially to the major OS version). Look at the recent ads in Windows file explorer for one example. A lot of the advice to turn Windows Update off is a misguided response to Microso…

I turned off Windows Update precisely because it tried to force and trick me into upgrading to Windows 10. This is their fault for making people distrust what Windows Update should be, and whoever made that decisions at Microsoft should get fired.

Same story here. :-(

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#387

Post by supernovae »

mattnewton wrote: post #377
supernovae wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is now fixed.. But inversely, i'm annoyed that this "upgrade phenomena" seems squarely targeted at Microsoft when people who run Linux or OSX upgrade the second new shiny comes out. I'm not ranting here other than expressing a curiosity of culture that leads to cultural problems lingering much longer than they should. Windows 10 is awesome.. the experiment with "ads" sucks but its all tweakable.. just jump to Rs…

When Linux or OSX upgrades without my consent, rebooting while I am using it, then I will scream about it too. Until then, I see no hypocrasy.

Again, this is configurable now.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#388

Post by jamie_ca »

novaleaf wrote: post #356
sangnoir wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Microsoft shares part of the blame here for pushing features that the user clearly doesn't want through updates (especially to the major OS version). Look at the recent ads in Windows file explorer for one example. A lot of the advice to turn Windows Update off is a misguided response to Microsoft's own bone-headed moves in recent years to install bullshit that the user doesn't want. Vaccinations are awesome, but M…

I don't think this is the reason why most people (non tech savvy) look to turning off Windows Update. Most people don't know/care about Windows Update pushing features. However most people DO care when their computers spontaneously reboot themselves with no warning (sometimes even in the middle of "active hours"!) which is what msft has set by default (and indeed has/had no UI to modify in some versions of Win10)

"Active Hours" is such a stupid idea, too. I'm perfectly happy if my box has to reboot at 3am for updates, but I do actually make use of it in the morning as well as into the night, and as it shares some home-fileserver duties for the rest of my family, it gets used sporadically throughout the day.

In its infinite wisdom Windows won't let me set "7am-11pm" as active hours - it caps it at either 10 or 12 hours. So no matter what I set it to, Windows 10 updates will inconvenience me more than just about any other OS in the house.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#389

Post by gregmac »

supernovae wrote: post #374
novaleaf wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is the reason why most people (non tech savvy) look to turning off Windows Update. Most people don't know/care about Windows Update pushing features. However most people DO care when their computers spontaneously reboot themselves with no warning (sometimes even in the middle of "active hours"!) which is what msft has set by default (and indeed has/had no UI to modify in some versions of Win10)

This is now fixed.. But inversely, i'm annoyed that this "upgrade phenomena" seems squarely targeted at Microsoft when people who run Linux or OSX upgrade the second new shiny comes out. I'm not ranting here other than expressing a curiosity of culture that leads to cultural problems lingering much longer than they should. Windows 10 is awesome.. the experiment with "ads" sucks but its all tweakable.. just jump to Rs…

>> However most people DO care when their computers spontaneously reboot themselves with no warning (sometimes even in the middle of "active hours"!)

> This is now fixed..

Once bitten, twice shy.

Most if not all of the non-tech people I work with would respond to this with "yeah, well, I don't care, I don't want to take the chance it reboots during a presentation/webinar/demo/etc ever again".

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#390

Post by supernovae »

GhotiFish wrote: post #383
supernovae wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is now fixed.. But inversely, i'm annoyed that this "upgrade phenomena" seems squarely targeted at Microsoft when people who run Linux or OSX upgrade the second new shiny comes out. I'm not ranting here other than expressing a curiosity of culture that leads to cultural problems lingering much longer than they should. Windows 10 is awesome.. the experiment with "ads" sucks but its all tweakable.. just jump to Rs…

I guess in the same way a farmer might listen to its cattle? A nasty disease or two would get fixed, nice food to keep them fed, but if they're telling the farmers "don't eat me" I can't imagine the farmers would be very receptive. Likewise. Stop spying on me, stop advertising to me, stop pushing products I don't want on me, stop treating my computer like your personal playground. None of this is going to gain tracti…

It is fixed. When you upgrade to RS2 it asks you about the services and you can disable them and you can disable automatic updates.

BTW, this isn't unique to MS.. phones update all the time and the concept of the phone is going to change.. soon you will have just one device that does everything. Are people going to complain that MS can't then do what Apple/Google do in regards to spying, updates & patches?

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