Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update • Hacker News Board

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#261

Post by II2II » Mon, May 15, 2017, 1:55 PM UTC

noja wrote: post #49

CydeWeys wrote: post #4

I love the way he's compared the people who tell you to turn off auto-updates with anti-vaxxers; it's quite an apt analogy. Microsoft shares part of the blame here for pushing features that the user clearly doesn't want through updates (especially to the major OS version). Look at the recent ads in Windows file explorer for one example. A lot of the advice to turn Windows Update off is a misguided response to Microso…

> I love the way he's compared the people who tell you to turn off auto-updates with anti-vaxxers; it's quite an apt analogy. This is a good analogy, but does it work in different circumstances? (Apologies for the derail) Over on Android , the apps have got so big (and the storage was until recently so small) that automatic updates _cannot_ be installed - the new apps are too big, the phone is full. What do we do the…

A more accurate analogy would be going to the doctor to get vaccinated, only to discover that it comes with a dental checkup and cleaning. Some people are going to love that. Others are going to wonder why they got something that they did not ask for. A few are going to become paranoid and claim that the doctor also injected a brainwashing drug (even if there is no grounds for their claim).

Microsoft needs to deliver updates in tiers in order to regain trust. Simply dividing it up into mandatory security updates, optional bug fixes, and optional feature upgrades would go a long way to addressing that even if the default is for all three tiers.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#262

Post by bigbugbag » Mon, May 15, 2017, 1:57 PM UTC

madiathomas wrote: post #212

bigbugbag wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a few possible alternative: switch to a different kind of OS, use sneakernet to share updates with people around you. etc

Majority of software I use only available on Windows. Visual Studio, MS SQL Server and Microsoft Office. I tried switching to Fedora.

I'm not sure about Visual Studio but there are alternative to MS SQL Server and Microsoft office. If you're stuck with windows, then you should consider sharing resources with other people in a similar situation.

Download the updates manually and share them via USB storage with other peoples, assuming you have other people in similar situation around you and they are willing to do the same.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#263

Post by dublinben » Mon, May 15, 2017, 1:59 PM UTC

bigbugbag wrote: post #84

Does this guy work for microsoft ? It reads like a partisant piece for microsoft. Totally overlooked the suspicious timeline of Microsoft releasing patched for vulnerabilities that were exploited for a long time by the NSA right after it was made apparent those had been stolen and were about to be released in the wild. No question asked about NSA having known and exploited those vulnerabilities for a while, no questi…

He isn't directly on their payroll[0], but he is definitely not a neutral observer. He has financial interest in Microsoft's success, as he is primarily a consultant for their products.

[0] https://www.troyhunt.com/microsoft-regional-director/

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#264

Post by uranian » Mon, May 15, 2017, 1:59 PM UTC

Turning off Windows update is not enough I'm afraid. Better remove this misery-ware completely from your pc and move to Linux. Linux is better, safer, cheaper, and more fun overall!

For apps that don't run on Linux for now, like Adobe, I'd rather move to OSX. Only reason for me to install Windows would be some obscure game that only runs on that platform. I honestly cannot think of any other reason to install Windows.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#265

Post by ebiester » Mon, May 15, 2017, 1:59 PM UTC

a2decrow wrote: post #213

throwaway2048 wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Id say the comparison would actually make sense if vaccines DID give you autism.

But they don't. Autism is the product of having a differently wired brain than a non-autist does. It's something you're born with, not something you can get later. Certain medications used by pregnant women can result in children being autistic, but I seriously doubt that this extends to any vaccines as well. Perhaps some really exotic ones maybe, but common vaccination definitely not. Source: I am autistic, read up…

That's a mistranslation of the above post. The poster intended to say that Microsoft's updates can be legitimately harmful whereas modern vaccines aren't.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#266

Post by joonoro » Mon, May 15, 2017, 2:00 PM UTC

Yizahi wrote: post #149

Everyone know why updates really are disabled - pirated Windows. Specifically - pirated Windows with badly written hack that fails after certain updates are installed. Given that how enormous is user base of pirated Windows it is expected really to to see lots of guidelines how to disable Windows Update. Win10 takes it to the other extreme, where it is impossible to disable it. You can only disable it for Wi-Fi and f…

Came here to say this. Many of my friends run pirated copies of Windows because they cannot afford a license, and they cannot use Linux either because they are dependent on Windows software.

Usually I'd say it's their own fault but fuck it, it's Microsoft's fault. Everyone knows Windows licenses are overpriced and that if Microsoft actually cared about collective security they'd bring the price down. Stop pretending you're not a part of infrastructure.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#267

Post by lois » Mon, May 15, 2017, 2:02 PM UTC

Maybe this will inspire Microsoft to come up with an update system that doesn't mandate a system restart.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#268

Post by bigbugbag » Mon, May 15, 2017, 2:05 PM UTC

setq wrote: post #118

cousin_it wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You fill your car up with fuel regularly because it has been warning you it's nearly empty for a while I like this analogy! A car that runs out of fuel when its manufacturer tells it to! > Windows only updates when you're doing something because you're putting everyone else at risk Are you sure it's me putting people at risk, and not Microsoft?

It's you. Look at the spread of this malware. If MS17-010 was applied automatically unconditionally, this would have not spread. The global scale of it shows how the end user is less trustworthy than the vendor.

Ok let's place the 'if' game.

- If Microsoft had coded its software properly there would be no need to patch vulnerabilites,

- If the NSA had told Microsoft about the vulnerabilities when they were discovered instead of exploiting it (Assuming the NSA did not tell MS to not patch them on purpose),

- If Microsoft did not have decades of being untrustworthy gathering the logical response of disabling auto-updates,

- If Microsoft had not paid vendors to have windows pre-installed on new computers it would have the monopolistic position it has today,

- if the NSA exploit and tools had not been made public,

- and so on...

All these are also valid ways that would have prevented wannacry spreading.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#269

Post by noxToken » Mon, May 15, 2017, 2:06 PM UTC

simias wrote: post #215

throwaway47861 wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not Microsoft's fault that you can't say "no", though.

That's not my point. Enabling Windows Update shouldn't be a trade-off. The fact that disabling it constitutes a quality-of-life improvement for many demonstrates that Microsoft is doing something terribly wrong. I should be able to tell my friends "yes, you should turn on auto updates, there's absolutely no reason not to" without having to follow with any caveats like "oh well, it can upgrade your OS, reboot on you w…

Not that MS is completely without fault, but we have to remember that they're supporting an infinite amount of configurations. Apple's OSX (on the other hand) is supposed to support a limit configuration controlled by Apple. It's a recipe for disaster.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#270

Post by inetknght » Mon, May 15, 2017, 2:08 PM UTC

capitalF wrote: post #145

eiji wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taskbar > Context menu > Cortana > ( Hidden / Show icon / Show search box )

A better option is to open "gpedit.msc", then open "Local Computer Policy -> Computer Configuration -> Administrative Templates -> Windows Components" Then spend an afternoon going through each option, setting enabled/disabled for everything you don't want or don't recognize. You can easily disable entire subsystems like Cortana, tips, telemetry, camera, biometrics, error reporting, games, Homegroup, Defender, Window…

Unfortunately I've had Windows 10 turn OneDrive integration back on even after disabling it. That was literally the nail in the coffin for me; I've since uninstalled Windows 10. I'm still using Windows 7 for games. Anything else is done on Linux.

When 7 goes end-of-life, I'll be 100% Linux.