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Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

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Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#191

Post by throwaway2048 »

bigbugbag wrote: post #98
CydeWeys wrote: post #4

I love the way he's compared the people who tell you to turn off auto-updates with anti-vaxxers; it's quite an apt analogy. Microsoft shares part of the blame here for pushing features that the user clearly doesn't want through updates (especially to the major OS version). Look at the recent ads in Windows file explorer for one example. A lot of the advice to turn Windows Update off is a misguided response to Microso…

The anti-vaxxers analogy is utter nonsense and reads like a poor attempt at hitting the credibility of people disabling windows update. The anti-vaxxer movement makes no sense outside the backfire effect, in almost all cases it has little to no basis or justifications. On the other hand there is a long history of very valid reasons of distrusting windows update and disabling it. Using windows update to force people i…

Id say the comparison would actually make sense if vaccines DID give you autism.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#192

Post by throwaway47861 »

simias wrote: post #47
jamespo wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, most people turned it off because they didn't want updates interrupting them. You are vastly overestimating who cares about "MS malware".

I'm still inclined to blame that on MS really. Poor ergonomics. I can understand the OS telling me to reboot if I haven't restarted the computer in a few days after an update took place but there's no reason to harass me immediately after an update got installed (unless it's a critical 0-day patch I suppose). But really, it's getting worse. I remember seeing a bunch of articles last month about how to preemptively de…

It's not Microsoft's fault that you can't say "no", though.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#194

Post by vocatus_gate »

sumanthvepa wrote: post #184
vocatus_gate wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm Army Reserve and we frequently have this problem in field exercises. Fire up some Win10 laptops on our very limited Verizon MiFi access point, they promptly download gig's of updates without consent and immediately push the bandwidth past the limit and the AP gets throttled to oblivion. Yeah yeah you can turn of Windows updates or whatever, but you shouldn't have to do that just to force Microsoft to respect your…

Windows 10 has the option of specifying that a specific network is a metered connection. It won't update the OS when connected to those networks. Found this out the hard way after getting a big bill while traveling and tethering to my phone's 4G connection.

Good idea thanks. We'll check it out. But of course again, that's not something the user should have to do (and not something we want to have to do on every single system that connects). Wifi != "unlimited bandwidth."

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#195

Post by bigbugbag »

madiathomas wrote: post #81
setq wrote: post #11

I don't know why people complain about updates and restarting, particularly in this thread. You fill your car up with fuel regularly because it has been warning you it's nearly empty for a while much like updates remind you regularly. People seem to complain and say "it updated right when I was in the middle of X" but they've been putting it off for ages. Do you break down in the middle of the motorway when you run o…

In my case, it is simply too expensive to download updates. I live in a country which is notorious for expensive data prices. I don't mind interruptions. That's a good problem to have. The choice for me is between spending a week's worth of groceries to download updates periodically or spending that money to buy food and risk getting my PC infected.

You have a few possible alternative: switch to a different kind of OS, use sneakernet to share updates with people around you. etc

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#196

Post by creshal »

enzanki_ars wrote: post #186
vocatus_gate wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked in Antarctica last year, a "winter-over" contract as combination Network Engineer/Glacier Search and Rescue (GSAR) team member, at one of the very small U.S. research stations. In the atmospheric/climatology lab there are a number of computers running very specific versions of Windows (down to specific patches) tailored to really obscure science research software packages, some industry standard, most custom…

EDIT: Didn't recognize the username at first. I still have some doubts, but I do remember you talking about going to Antarctica in the Tron subreddit. I recently used Tron, and I hope that there isn't some undocumented part of the script that is disabling automatic updates. I have some doubts about this story... The forced Windows 10 update was only sent to non-enterprise versions of Windows. I highly doubt any of th…

It was sent to all versions of Windows, as long as they weren't part of an Active Directory domain, and that detection was pretty flakey, too.

If you had a mixed OS environment with a Samba-based domain (or no domain at all, because these machines just take data from lab equipment and shovel it onto network shares), there was a good chance of the update firing off anyway.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#197

Post by saiya-jin »

capitalF wrote: post #145
eiji wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taskbar > Context menu > Cortana > ( Hidden / Show icon / Show search box )

A better option is to open "gpedit.msc", then open "Local Computer Policy -> Computer Configuration -> Administrative Templates -> Windows Components" Then spend an afternoon going through each option, setting enabled/disabled for everything you don't want or don't recognize. You can easily disable entire subsystems like Cortana, tips, telemetry, camera, biometrics, error reporting, games, Homegroup, Defender, Window…

last time I checked with people suffering from Windows 10, the shit still keeps annoying them, even after all is disabled. something changed on that front?

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#198

Post by vocatus_gate »

enzanki_ars wrote: post #186
vocatus_gate wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked in Antarctica last year, a "winter-over" contract as combination Network Engineer/Glacier Search and Rescue (GSAR) team member, at one of the very small U.S. research stations. In the atmospheric/climatology lab there are a number of computers running very specific versions of Windows (down to specific patches) tailored to really obscure science research software packages, some industry standard, most custom…

EDIT: Didn't recognize the username at first. I still have some doubts, but I do remember you talking about going to Antarctica in the Tron subreddit. I recently used Tron, and I hope that there isn't some undocumented part of the script that is disabling automatic updates. I have some doubts about this story... The forced Windows 10 update was only sent to non-enterprise versions of Windows. I highly doubt any of th…

> I have some doubts about this story.... I highly doubt any of these experiments were running the home editions of Windows

I guess you've never worked with budget-constrained grant projects before.

> I do remember you talking about going to Antarctica in the Tron subreddit

7 months on ice.

> I hope that there isn't some undocumented part of the script that is disabling automatic updates.

Tron doesn't perform ANY undocumented actions. Unlike most the people defending Microsoft's actions in this thread, I am pro-user and seek to minimize negative impact to users in any project I'm involved in.

> Also, I am pretty sure that running home versions of Windows in contexts like this is against the Windows TOS.

If you're telling me there are people in the world using Windows in violation of its TOS I'm shocked, SHOCKED to say the least.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#199

Post by Silhouette »

mseebach wrote: post #185
Silhouette wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you operate such devices, it is an absolute imperative that you have a procedure for taking them offline regularly for updates In some contexts that simply isn't a viable strategy. As an extreme example, consider something like an implanted medical device that needs to run 24/7 for the rest of a person's life, which can only be replaced via surgery under hospital conditions, and for which any failure is already a…

Yes, things are complicated, but airlines manage to routinely take $100m devices out of service for days to months for servicing, so it seems like a bad excuse that a hospital can't plan around taking any given device offline for a few hours every couple of years.

But it's not every couple of years, is it? The patch for the current widespread problem was released just a couple of months ago, and there have been more security patches for other things since then.

Also, those $100m devices aren't in service 24/7/365. No-one takes an airplane out of service in mid-flight to apply a security update.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#200

Post by creshal »

dandare wrote: post #155
kbart wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because accessing and modifying computer systems without owner's prior agreement is a crime in most parts of the world. Why would MS, NSA or any other entity would risk potential trials?

Did MS not force upgrade users to Win10 against their will - which caused many of them to switch off autoupdate in the first place?

Yes, and litigation for it is ongoing in several countries.
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