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DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

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Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#151
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ehh, i mean for how much longer do we actually need pilots? I was under the impression they're mostly auto pilot these days anyway.

http://www.askthepilot.com/questionanswers/automation-myths/

Seems like a truly unbiased source.

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The nature of commercial flying is such that actual incidents are pretty rare (150 or so a year recently[1]), and very very expensive. So taking the "data-driven" approach to pushing what's safe really isn't economically feasible, to say nothing of the ethics issues. Instead the principle of "if it seems unsafe, it's probably unsafe" applies. I believe the situation mentioned in the article of riding for fourteen hou…

A crash of a cargo jet (eg. converted airliner approx. $40m value) is such a rare event that "bean counters" can justify a certain level of risk. A good comparison is SpaceX Falcon[0] or Orbital Sciences Antares launch vehicles. If they have a mishap, there is high probability that it'll take 6mo+ to return to flight. There is a significant cost to that ($300m+ cost to SpaceX, for vehicle replacement and compensation…

Someone needs to quantify the cost for various level of risks. If the air cargo industry could save an average of 1 live per year at the cost of $1B a year in additional costs to pass to it's customers, should it?

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#153
post #78

A few thoughts here. 1) DHL started in the US in 1969 and became German owned a little after 2002 (it has a pretty cool origin story where the founder felt there was a better way to deliver overnight goods to Hawaii than to literally sit a person on a plane and stuff legal documents in his luggage. He used his student loans to... "bootstrap"). IMO the article loses some credibility by using "foreign competition" verb…

You are correct DHL is an interesting story. But you left out the most interesting parts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Hillblom

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#154
post #77

Anyone here - not me, but only because I live in Australia - who doesn't recognise they they are the problem, are the problem. We all want things, and we all want them the cheapest. Amazon is the cheapest. And how? This is how. We either get used to a world where things cost less and people all across the delivery chain get treated really shitty, or we all accept that we have to pay a dollar more for that 12-pack of…

Read the article carefully and you'll note that he was never required to pilot a plane 23 hours in a 24 hour period (which is against all regulations). He was forced to ride along with one flight in order to get to his work flight.

The author has a great job where he is well paid and occasionally has to sleep on a plane. What's the problem?

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#155

The lack of empathy in the comments is disconcerting. The post is a bit light on details (though the example given of flying 23 hours back-to-back continental flights is terrible if regular) the post deserves better than: 1. Pilots fly for fun. You made the wrong career move. 2. Capitalism! 3. you're lucky - imagine if you were a warehouse worker. He's a pilot, not an accountant or lawyer. He knows that there is pay…

I think CEO pay is what it is because they're narcissistic personalities who are very good coddling the fragile emotional state of board of directors, and they all make each other feel important and useful.

The only solution I see is a syndicalism, or perhaps participatory economics (one of those is real, has existed, the other is an idea possibly with no potential in the real world). Basically the only thing people understand is go fuck yourself. Let's face it. It's a might makes right world. People don't negotiate win win if they can negotiate I win you lose and that's a win, so go fuck yourself. It's always adversarial when a single entity owns both capital and means of production.

But the very idea of worker unions brings about the open question of committing murder by certain capitalists. It's that much of a threat to their ability to say and get away with, go fuck yourself.

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#156
post #97

The lack of empathy in the comments is disconcerting. The post is a bit light on details (though the example given of flying 23 hours back-to-back continental flights is terrible if regular) the post deserves better than: 1. Pilots fly for fun. You made the wrong career move. 2. Capitalism! 3. you're lucky - imagine if you were a warehouse worker. He's a pilot, not an accountant or lawyer. He knows that there is pay…

I think the lack of empathy is because cargo pilots flying for Amazon still have it much better than warehouse workers. Both job wise (nicer to fly than to pack) and with regards to the pay. Aviation is one of the most regulated sectors in both the US and worldwide. The reason why DHL uses subcontractors is not because they want to save money, they aren't allowed to fly in the US. Which is somehow interesting because…

How does the FAA get involved in regulating flights that originate and end outside the U.S.? The author states "I have been asked to sit on 14-hour flights from the UW to the Middle East, only to then fly the same aircraft to Asia on another nine-hour journey"

That means ferrying the pilots as passengers to location; at which point they become pilots for the next leg. It's still shit. It's bad ergonomically, it's very dehydrating, and you're getting a higher dose of cosmic rays. https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/aircrew/cosmicionizingradia...

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#157
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It then still sucks having to be in an aircraft for 23h, but he didn't have to work for 23h straight If you're away from what you'd rather be doing at the company's discretion, you're working.

You might think that, but the law actually currently uses a concept called "portal-to-portal". Companies only need to pay for time that is "integral and indispensable" to the labor in question. In short if you aren't actually earning money for the company, they don't necessarily need to pay you. It originated with mine workers who would have to take a long mine-elevator ride (30m+) to and from the vein, and companies…

This concept still exists, even applies to tech workers. http://appleinsider.com/articles/15/11/08/judge-dismisses-ap...

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#158
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been many first hand accounts from pilots about their industry's deteriorating work conditions. The denial and pedantry by the Freedom Market™ zealots is exhausting. Being highly trained and performing safety critical work does not exempt pilots from the predation of C (executive management) level exploitation. The root cause is the glut of labor, progressively reducing Labor's bargaining power, since the…

Better tax policy could do a lot. Our regressive tax policy is currently funneling economic growth to an ever smaller pool of people who simply don't need as many people to work for them (directly + indirectly). If the lower/middle class kept more of their paycheck they would spend more on services which would employ more people. Further, the economic death spiral of fewer people with disposable income => reduced dem…

The silent generation taxed themselves massively compared to the baby boomers. They had next to no national debt, and massive private and public infrastructure being built.

Today's wealthy and politically connected baby boomers cannot be bothered at all with this. They demand low taxes, stuffing the stock market with the bounty rather than starting or expanding businesses, and then charge the national credit card with all the costs of their unwillingness to contribute anything meaningful. Except maybe some halfway decent music - but that does not give them a pass for being greedy, stingy, hoarders.

At the moderate to low end of the pay scale, even 0% taxes fails to mitigate the wage stagnation problem. This really only gets fixed when the cost of hoarding becomes really fucking expensive. So expensive it's saner to take the risk on starting or growing a business, and the ensuing tax deductions that come with that (those are generally 100% tax deductible expenses by the way, with exceptions for gifts and entertainment).

Right now we don't have that. It's hoarding and credit charging time. And this bullshit tax cut proposal is even more of that.

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#159
post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been many first hand accounts from pilots about their industry's deteriorating work conditions. The denial and pedantry by the Freedom Market™ zealots is exhausting. Being highly trained and performing safety critical work does not exempt pilots from the predation of C (executive management) level exploitation. The root cause is the glut of labor, progressively reducing Labor's bargaining power, since the…

How about a movement that says, "If you can't earn a decent wage working 40 hours a week, sit under a bridge until you die for your country." Reducing the labor pool and showing the elites they can build their own roads, make their own coffee, and fly their own planes unless they allow all citizens to live with dignity after a 40 hour work week. I believe their is much more virtue in doing this than going to war to m…

I'm hearing you.

The part that slays me is we have so much useful work that needs doing, excess capital for want of high quality investments, and people demanding purposeful jobs.

The opportunities are insurmountable.

Re: DHL pilot alleges poor labor practices that are spreading throughout industry

#160
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Better tax policy could do a lot. Our regressive tax policy is currently funneling economic growth to an ever smaller pool of people who simply don't need as many people to work for them (directly + indirectly). If the lower/middle class kept more of their paycheck they would spend more on services which would employ more people. Further, the economic death spiral of fewer people with disposable income => reduced dem…

Agree. I support any measure that keeps money moving. Including cashectomies for windfall profits. But why, in the name of fairness, isn't the surplus shared with all the stakeholders? We wouldn't be in this pickle to begin with if profit sharing was the norm. Like when I was kid.

Sharing is socialism/communism/someother"bad"ism these days. It must be all about the invisible hand, the less intervention the better. Basically I see it as a bunch of greedy nuts who believe in things like low taxes, and only wince at overt things like primogeniture and unequal pay but then they pretty much do a "tee hee" and accept both because they benefit.

It's somewhere in the vicinity of neo-feudalism + neo-aristocracy + prosperity theology. It's an abomination.

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