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Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

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Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#61
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the major retail brokers sell their order flow, so you generally eat this cost no matter who you use. In addition, the hidden cost is fractions of a penny on the dollar (so still better than the $5-7 a regular broker charges per trade anyways).

What's the long play then? Surely Robin Hood isn't absorbing the the transaction fees as a loss leader just to increase it's user base? If that's the play, any other company can emulate that.. The incentive seems to be this may cause a price war with existing brokerages.

The long play is that it actually doesn't cost significant money per trade at an institutional level. The only reason the other major brokers charge you money is because it covers their brick and mortar retail costs (e.g. Scottrade) and it adds to the bottomline (e.g. Etrade). So Robin Hood is actually just giving this surplus to the consumer instead of keeping it for themselves, and building a user base / brand in the process. Eventually once they have enough users, they will start to up sell you for other services (e.g. checking/savings, margin trading, options trading, check writing etc).

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#63
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought it was based on the % you traded? So for example, if I was using an 100k account to trade, I had another 100k of leverage no?

At least often, yes, but you will also need approval to even get that far. Etrade for instance has several levels of approval. I note that Etrade at least implements it less as "margin approval" and more as "advanced mode"; to do any sort of options trades, even the ones that don't require margin themselves, requires you to activate the "margin feature" on your account.

Robinhood makes you accept a new agreement to be in Gold which sounds about the same as getting margin approval at a brokerage (agree to the risks and approval is automated). They don't have special powers to waive regulations.

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#64

“But ‘how are you going to make money long-term?’ has been a question mark” Bhatt says. Gold has answered that question.” A Gold subscription lets users borrow up to double the money in their account to trade on margin with leverage Wow, so that's effectively opening up new easy to get credit vehicles for unsophisticated investors. How could that go wrong? Even if you are a professional trader you'll take a bath on m…

Robinhood knows that people can just buy index funds and sit (which is what I do). But this doesn't make money, so they encourage people to buy individual stocks, "whatever new Elon Musk stock is out there", and trade on leverage.

To some extent they want to make Robinhood a game, rather than an investment platform.

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#65
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And regulated - you have to be approved for margin trading by the brokerage.

I thought it was based on the % you traded? So for example, if I was using an 100k account to trade, I had another 100k of leverage no?

It depends on the brokerage. There is Reg T. margin and then there is portfolio margin (the latter has significantly higher capital deposit requirements).

It also is not a straight 1:1 ratio. You generally can't go absolutely nuclear with leverage unless you have portfolio margin. Typically, brokerages will require collateral in the account equal to the risk (for defined risk strategies) and you will need a higher trading clearance on your account for unlimited risk.

Your buying power is a function of how long the trade will be held as well as the risk profile.

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lets say you're unsophisticated. You say "I like my 1080ti, so I'll buy some NVIDIA stock." I'm a tech stock expert, I know NVIDIA is on a downward slope because its over-valued right now. I tell you "Sure kid, here's a promise for 100 shares at today's price of $50 each." I take your $5,000. Everyone is happy. Joe Investor doesn't actually have the stock in his possession just yet. I buy the stock myself a few days…

Well, I don't think this is a legal use of order flow (waiting days to make a purchase), but the analogy is kinda sorta on the right path. Reality is more like "I know an order for NVIDIA is going to hit at $50, but I see it for sale for 49.9998 all over the place, I can go scoop some up at 49.9998 and put for sale at 49.9999 and make some money. But then real reality is a step more complicated about when it is legal…

Front running would be going the same direction (buy for buy).

In buying order flow, you are usually going in the opposite direction, selling out of you own inventory against a buy.

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you extrapolate on order flow from unsophisticated investors? Why is it valuable?

In the London stock market they used to have a game where traders got a stack of pictures of girls, and had to rate each picture based on what they thought the average rating for each picture would be from everyone else. This essentially captures what stock trading is. It's not just about figuring out which company is the "prettiest girl" on the market, you have to be able to predict which girl everyone else is going…

More succinctly: it is a Keynesian beauty contest.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keynesian_beauty_contest

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you extrapolate on order flow from unsophisticated investors? Why is it valuable?

Lets say you're unsophisticated. You say "I like my 1080ti, so I'll buy some NVIDIA stock." I'm a tech stock expert, I know NVIDIA is on a downward slope because its over-valued right now. I tell you "Sure kid, here's a promise for 100 shares at today's price of $50 each." I take your $5,000. Everyone is happy. Joe Investor doesn't actually have the stock in his possession just yet. I buy the stock myself a few days…

HK articles on finance sadden me. So much bad information.

The firm isn't buying days later after a price craters. They are usually buying or selling out of their own inventory. Sometimes this is speculative trades, more often it is more mundane like saving transaction fees (and a higher certainty of transacting) from going to the market.

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#69

I use Robinhood daily and love it. Low level traders could care less if HFT are making a penny off them. Also you can put limit orders....... No way I could trade the way I do and still make money if I was paying 7$ or more per trade. Crazy the industry can charge that much.

Same exact situation here. Because I put in lots of relatively small dollar value trades $10 transaction fees at TD Ameritrade would eat all my profits pretty quickly.

Still a lot, but TD dropped their fee to $6.95 https://www.tdameritrade.com/pricing.page

Re: Robinhood stock trading app confirms $110M raise at $1.3B valuation

#70

“But ‘how are you going to make money long-term?’ has been a question mark” Bhatt says. Gold has answered that question.” A Gold subscription lets users borrow up to double the money in their account to trade on margin with leverage Wow, so that's effectively opening up new easy to get credit vehicles for unsophisticated investors. How could that go wrong? Even if you are a professional trader you'll take a bath on m…

Eh I don't consider it a new credit vehicle, margin trading is available in every trading platform. It doesn't make a huge difference for Robinhood; they'll issue a margin call if you're undercapitalized, so the likelihood you would lose any of Robinhood's money is very low.

As for the investors, the percentage rate is very reasonable; given standard market conditions you'd make good money using robinhood gold and putting it in SPY. It's a pretty smart move to charge for it IMO.

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