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Uber CEO Plays with Fire

nytimes.com

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Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#41

Post by 1024core »

pdog wrote: post #36

From the article, explained: At the time, Uber was dealing with widespread account fraud in places like China, where tricksters bought stolen iPhones that were erased of their memory and resold. Some Uber drivers there would then create dozens of fake email addresses to sign up for new Uber rider accounts attached to each phone, and request rides from those phones, which they would then accept. Since Uber was handing…

Ah, I get it now. The author took a shortcut.

Basically, they created a unique 'fingerprint' of the iPhone. It was unique enough that even if you reinstalled the app, the fingerprint would still be the same. This was done, ostensibly, to prevent people from scamming them by reinstalling the app and coming over as new users? But they already have the phone number, so I don't understand the point.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#42

Post by [deleted] »

pdog wrote: post #36

From the article, explained: At the time, Uber was dealing with widespread account fraud in places like China, where tricksters bought stolen iPhones that were erased of their memory and resold. Some Uber drivers there would then create dozens of fake email addresses to sign up for new Uber rider accounts attached to each phone, and request rides from those phones, which they would then accept. Since Uber was handing…

[deleted]

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#43

Post by _jal »

I've thought the guy is slimy scum for some time, but that article made something click.

One consistent feature of Kalanick's tactics appears to be a proclivity for gaslighting on an industrial scale - geofencing Apple, regulators, etc.

Among (many) other things, I would never trust any data sourced solely to anything under his control.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#44

Post by geofft »

ajross wrote: post #11
h1fra wrote: post #2

No one seems to explain how Uber could track user when the have deleted the app ? It look more like an hack more than "a lack of boundaries" to me...

That's what I'm asking too. This is the first reporting of what sure sounds like an iOS security vulnerability exploited by the Uber app, and there's no technical content at all, it's just a description of a phone call between two executives. Come on, NYT!

There's technical content at the bottom of the article:

To halt the activity, Uber engineers assigned a persistent identity to iPhones with a small piece of code, a practice called “fingerprinting.” Uber could then identify an iPhone and prevent itself from being fooled even after the device was erased of its contents.

There was one problem: Fingerprinting iPhones broke Apple’s rules. Mr. Cook believed that wiping an iPhone should ensure customers that no trace of the owner’s identity remained on the device.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#45

Post by ars »

For all the criticism he is getting, this would never have happened without him. Taxi companies are too strong, and the US needed someone like him to break barriers.

Lyft would never have existed without Uber. Now that Uber broke through the path (and is getting destroyed for it) the way is open for lots of other companies.

It happens all the time that the company that invents or creates something new, does not actually reap the rewards because the cost of creating it was so high they die in the process - but leave the way open for other companies.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#46

Post by zzalpha »

1024core wrote: post #41
pdog wrote: post #36

From the article, explained: At the time, Uber was dealing with widespread account fraud in places like China, where tricksters bought stolen iPhones that were erased of their memory and resold. Some Uber drivers there would then create dozens of fake email addresses to sign up for new Uber rider accounts attached to each phone, and request rides from those phones, which they would then accept. Since Uber was handing…

Ah, I get it now. The author took a shortcut. Basically, they created a unique 'fingerprint' of the iPhone. It was unique enough that even if you reinstalled the app, the fingerprint would still be the same. This was done, ostensibly, to prevent people from scamming them by reinstalling the app and coming over as new users? But they already have the phone number, so I don't understand the point.

Phone numbers can be trivially changed.

In the article this is in the context of fraudsters buying used phones to fake rides in China and take advantage of incentive programs to make money. So they want to track these devices as they change hands.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#47

Post by Kallikrates »

pdog wrote: post #36

From the article, explained: At the time, Uber was dealing with widespread account fraud in places like China, where tricksters bought stolen iPhones that were erased of their memory and resold. Some Uber drivers there would then create dozens of fake email addresses to sign up for new Uber rider accounts attached to each phone, and request rides from those phones, which they would then accept. Since Uber was handing…

Could be via other apps using ubers native sdk writing to a common key store. ala Google sharing auth between apps on iOS.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#48

Post by pfortuny »

As always with corporate "justice", if you are big enough and transgress, you simply get a slap. If you are a tiny developer, your app is out of the store and may be at some point you may get it back.

Truly blind justice.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#49

Post by ars »

zitterbewegung wrote: post #22
taude wrote: post #18

I really hope Lyft doesn't do anything to screw up, as I've uninstalled Uber and will probably never use the service again. However, I don't see myself going back to regular taxi system as that's even more corrupt and despicable. I just hope Lyft plays the game with a social conscious and makes positive decisions and continues to treat drivers well (most Lyft drivers I talk to say they like driving for Lyft way bette…

I don't think you can support a ridesharing company that by design treats employees as contractors and also be socially conscious . If you really want to do this use public transportation .

> I don't think you can support a ridesharing company that by design treats employees as contractors and also be socially conscious .

I fail to see what one has to do with the other. Can you explain?

Seems to me the opposite is the case - as a contractor the driver has full control, but as an employee how hard he works has little to do with how much he gets paid.

Re: Uber CEO Plays with Fire

#50

Post by sandworm101 »

pavlov wrote: post #38
ForHackernews wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm not so sure that as a society we should be rewarding people with drive like this "Mr. Kalanick, 40, is driven to the point that he must win at whatever he puts his mind to and at whatever cost". I hope he loses big. Losing everything because of a sociopathic drive to win? That's the stuff of classical tragedy.

The American obsession with winning has definitely jumped the shark with Kalanick and Trump. At least I'm getting tired of all this "winning".

Note that it isnt about doing well or making money. "Winning" requires competition, an enemy to destroy. Uber's approach is similar to napster's: damage the entrenched busines model (taxis) at all costs. These people will let thier companies burn so long as the enemy burns a tiny bit more. On the other side are lots of destoyed lives (drivers and investors) but the men on top are still "winning" thier silly game.
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