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H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

economist.com

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Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#91

Post by pm90 »

jldugger wrote: post #37
ta78637 wrote: post #7

Article's concluding sentences: "Reducing the number of visas for TCS and its brethren would probably result in them shifting work to India. A better change would be to end the rule whereby H-1B recipients must stay with the company that sponsored them. For within their ranks may lurk the next Elon Musk or Sergey Brin." Personally I find this line of thought (cliche?) frustrating. Not just because apparently us prole…

Basking in future billionaires could mean taxing them to fix US education systems (or a lifetime supply of mojitos, I don't care) so it's not all bad. But there's a knock on effect -- if you go to the effort of sponsoring an H1-B with the intention of underpaying them, then changing the rules to allow visa holders to leave you for a job that pays job (or better work-life balance or has a mojito bar) would leave you h…

I think this is a rather pessimistic view of the benefits of hiring intelligent and hard working people to work for your country's companies. Its most certainly not in the disparity of pay; more because they provide more value, due to said intelligence and proclivity to work hard.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#92

Post by azakai »

inlinefordecade wrote: post #71
molyss wrote: post #10

"Given that the unemployment rate for college graduates sits at 2.5%, it is fair to say that most native workers displaced by H-1Bs land on their feet." That's completely ignoring the fact that if you have cheaper workers, you end up being underpaid and/or doing a job you'd rather not be doing. Unemployment rate alone don't tell the whole story, and failing to acknowledge that sounds like poor/partial journalism to m…

To me it appears TCS and Infosys are being made the fall guys to keep the existing system of Indentured servitude in place for another decade or more. [edit:] Real villain is Microsoft, which has the largest lobbyists machine among the software companies in D.C. to make sure they are able to keep their indenture servants for as many years as possible.

Actually Google spends more on lobbying than Microsoft, and has for a while now.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/3024945/major-tech-companies-...

Google spent almost twice as much as Microsoft in 2015, for example.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#93

Post by inlinefordecade »

usernametbd wrote: post #90
inlinefordecade wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me it appears TCS and Infosys are being made the fall guys to keep the existing system of Indentured servitude in place for another decade or more. [edit:] Real villain is Microsoft, which has the largest lobbyists machine among the software companies in D.C. to make sure they are able to keep their indenture servants for as many years as possible.

Why is Microsoft villain? Does it provide its H1B employees below market salary? Genuinely asking as I've seen H1B employees at MS paid a huge salary, equal to their citizen counterparts, and also they've been freely jumping companies to get an even bigger pay raise.

Please see my response: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14144354

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#94

Post by pm90 »

jldugger wrote: post #40
anindha wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is startups would find it hard to hire since it's hard to value equity in a visa application.

Oh well? If payment in scrip lottery tickets isn't considered good enough for minimum wage laws, I don't see why this would be any different.

You actually bring up an interesting point. A startup lures employees with promise of huge payouts in its shares. But it cannot use those offered shares in an all cash competitive war to get H1B's based solely on cash.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#95

Post by praneshp »

urbanxs wrote: post #11

As a european there is almost 0 chance of going In the us. H1B go to indians, low paid jobs to mexicans. I dont mind either of them, but allowing europeans in would be less discriminatory.

I can get why Americans are pissed off by H1Bs going to Indians. Why are you pissed off? You go through the same lottery process as Indians, no?

I would think that there is a percentage of the spots going to people who put in multiple applications, but that affects everyone equally (and that sort of fraud is an equal opportunity employer).

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#96

Post by HillaryBriss »

weirdstuff wrote: post #13

On these more controversial political threads: How are certain accounts instantaneously downvoted to dead on HN, within single-digit seconds? Seems automated but entirely too hard to tell. For example, l3m0ndr0p (yeah, I'm totally him/her) made an "America first" type of comment. I know that doesn't play well with a lot of HNers, but seeing it instantly downvoted to dead was weird, too. I know there's a left-ish bias…

> l3m0ndr0p (yeah, I'm totally him/her) made an "America first" type of comment.

on the topic of "America First", i wonder if there's a double standard.

if Apple/Facebook/Microsoft/Google/et al say "if we don't reform immigration policies to allow more talented people to enter the US, America will lose its position of technical leadership" that's basically an "America First" argument. but in reality these companies are basically motivated by their own desire to make more cash. and it's not very controversial.

by contrast, if some individual middle class US resident says "H1B visa holders are costing me money by depressing salaries" that's basically an "America First" argument too, even though that person is basically motived by their own desire to make more cash. but it's quite controversial.

is corporate greed somehow more acceptable than individual greed? is there a kind of bias against the little guy?

why isn't everyone equally entitled to advocate for their own greed?

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#97

Post by inlinefordecade »

azakai wrote: post #92
inlinefordecade wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me it appears TCS and Infosys are being made the fall guys to keep the existing system of Indentured servitude in place for another decade or more. [edit:] Real villain is Microsoft, which has the largest lobbyists machine among the software companies in D.C. to make sure they are able to keep their indenture servants for as many years as possible.

Actually Google spends more on lobbying than Microsoft, and has for a while now. http://www.pcworld.com/article/3024945/major-tech-companies-... Google spent almost twice as much as Microsoft in 2015, for example.

It is good that other companies are catching up. But, MSFT got the AWICA and AC-21 acts passed decades ago, which directly resulted in indentured servitude. MSFT lobbyists are the founders and architects of the "indentured servitude".

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#98

Post by zzleeper »

I went through the entire comment thread and feel like you guys are missing a lot of the H1B benefits by focusing just on tech and the effect of the Indian consultancies.

Most PhDs, specially in STEM, math, stats, econ, etc. are not American. And almost all of them end up with a H1B visa at some point if they remain in the US.

It might be lottery based if you go to work at any firm, or quota-free if it is in academia/nonprofits/govt, but it's still through H1B.

Now, what happens if you kill the H1B?

1) Applications from qualified foreigners to US PhDs drop a lot, because they know they won't be able to find a US-based job. 2) Every firm that does R&D, from Boeing to Amazon, will lose out on a large pool of very skilled workers, that are very hard to replace (how easy is it to replace a CS PhD working on LIDARs for self driving cars?)

All in all, I don't think critics understand this side of the value of the H1B to the US. Every year, you guys take some of the best engineers and researchers across the world, and move them to very useful roles in the US economy.

Disclaimer: I'm currently in an H1B, and would like to think my work contributes to the US. So reading all this makes me a bit sad (and unwelcome).

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#99

Post by epa »

l3m0ndr0p wrote: post #6

Regardless of where these jobs are going, H1-Bs are used for the cheap labor, not the best skills. This system has been abused especially by the financial services corporations. First hand experience: If you have an open request to hire, you are required to first look to one of the few outsourcing firms we have a contract with. You cannot post the job for external until you have searched for the "best" person within…

American Apparel and Dov Charney tried the hire american model and it was successful until he was forced out.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#100

Post by s73ver »

jcriddle4 wrote: post #28

unemployment rate ... 2.5%. This study has 5.6% unemployment and under employment at 12.6% http://www.epi.org/publication/class-of-2016/

Could one be the unemployment rate of all with a college degree, and one be the unemployment rate of recent grads?
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