Did they arrest him before removing him? Surely that would be the right thing to do. If they do not have a reason for arresting him then they can't just beat people up to act as "security" for the airline. If they had arrested him and read him his rights I'm sure he'd have understood that the gravity of the situation was such that he really had to stand up and leave.
A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
181–190 of 549 posts
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#182The outrage mob is pushing this pretty hard. Booting people off a plane is pretty shitty behavior for an airline. It's bad customer service and they should dealt with it earlier than after boarding. But if they have to do it, the passenger shouldn't be allowed to just refuse. This guy did. And he had to get dragged off the plane. I don't really see an alternative other than just letting anyone willing to scream to st…
Reasonableness is what faceless bureaucracies use to keep everyone in line. In the modern world, half the time an individual is wronged, there is literally no recourse but to speak to an endless string of "agents" who in fact bear no agency and no responsibility. It's a daily occurrence that we get thrust into these kafkaesque situations, and by no means is it our responsibility to take this bullshit with a happy shit-eating smile.
So no, no the passenger was not unreasonable, this is the only type of thing that gets their leadership far above the rank and file to take enough notice to actually change policies to something reasonable which is this: pay enough for volunteers. You overbooked the flight, you pay the price, simple as that.
For the love of god, don't side with corporations where the ones setting the policies and profiting are far removed from both the enforcers of those policies, and the customers suffering at their hands. This is probably the number one source of social problems in the modern age: lack of individual accountability.
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
Whoever decided to force the guy off the plane is an idiot. They could have simply raised the comp for volunteering slowly until someone took the money.
According to Reddit hearsay they offered increasing amounts up to $800 but no one budged. One passenger offered to leave for $1500 and the crew laughed. I'm assuming there's corporate policy that puts a maximum cap on compensation.
Any maximum cap is ridiculous. Let the free market reign!
The flight itself represents many tens of thousands of dollars of fares.
United have a price they were willing to cost the seat, they were unwilling to bear the cost.
Either way, it's United's PR disaster to handle.
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#184Earlier quoted context omitted.
What are they legally required to offer before they can just pick people?
If they pick someone they are entitled to 4 x ticket capped at $1350.
Hmm. So for Chicago to Louisville, $800 could plausibly have been 4 x ticket. So that could be the max that United was required to offer.
Note the weasel wording. I don't actually know.
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
United employees taking passenger's seats? That's not overbooked. That's robbery.
Not like united employees going on vacation or to a meeting. But a flight crew going to where they need to be. It's part and parcel of an airline service. If they can't get to where they need to be a flight will have to be delayed or canceled.
If it was flight crew, how on earth did they not know how many employees would be needed ahead of time?
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#186Earlier quoted context omitted.
If there's equipment waiting in Louisville, and another entire plane isn't going anywhere without them, that's how its justifiable. IDB means you can (legally) be physically removed from a flight. With that said, don't drag people off your flights. No matter what it costs you to get staff where they need to be when you make this mistake, it'll be cheaper than the negative publicity of a physical altercation removing…
> With that said, don't drag people off your flights. No matter what it costs you to get staff where they need to be when you make this mistake, it'll be cheaper than the negative publicity of a physical altercation removing a passenger (even if you need to retask a commuter aircraft just to relocate the crew, or ask another carrier to get them there). Of course, that just gives a hecker's veto to anyone insubordinat…
No, what they should have done is exactly what other airlines do when they are overbooked: keep raising the voucher amount until someone volunteers to get off. And if you can't find someone to get off at a price that seems appropriate (which is very unlikely: you're always going to find someone willing to take $1000), work out other arrangements.
The moment you've escalated to "we've selected people at random, and we are willing to eject people by violence or arrest them on the other end" you've already lost.
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#187The real thing to fear here is the normalization of violence. Good perspective in the WP comments: "The truly shocking thing here is that violence - with the real possibility of serious injury - was viewed as appropriate in a situation that was purely logistical. The airline wanted seats for its own employees. This was not an emergency - such as a terrorist attack or a drunk passenger endangering people. The lack of…
Agreed. I for one will never fly United again. I hope many others do the same. The way that was handled just goes to show the culture and way things are done at that airline. Nobody had the logic to say, wait a minute, this is wrong. Calling the police to throw a passenger who did nothing wrong off? Countless ways to handle this better.
In the end, this is going to cost United a TON. United could have flown a plane with only those 4 employees on it for way less than the hit they are about to take.
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#188The outrage mob is pushing this pretty hard. Booting people off a plane is pretty shitty behavior for an airline. It's bad customer service and they should dealt with it earlier than after boarding. But if they have to do it, the passenger shouldn't be allowed to just refuse. This guy did. And he had to get dragged off the plane. I don't really see an alternative other than just letting anyone willing to scream to st…
Do they not have those "Catch Me If You Can" era jumpseats for deadheads anymore?
They don't have four of them.
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#189Today must be a fun day to be on United's PR team.
Given things, I would bet United's lobbyists are going to have a bit of fun also, because this is something sure to get a Congressperson on TV.
Re: A man wouldn’t leave an overbooked United flight, so he was dragged off
#190The real thing to fear here is the normalization of violence. Good perspective in the WP comments: "The truly shocking thing here is that violence - with the real possibility of serious injury - was viewed as appropriate in a situation that was purely logistical. The airline wanted seats for its own employees. This was not an emergency - such as a terrorist attack or a drunk passenger endangering people. The lack of…
So what do you do when someone refuses to leave? I'm on the doctor's side, United should not overbook a plane and bump a customer to get their own people on board, but when someone refuses to leave what other options do you have? Taze him and drag him off? You'll have to use force to remove someone.
There was no reason for this to even get to a point where physically removing a passenger who did nothing wrong was necessary. There was a very simple solution here: United wanted 4 seats, offered some vouchers, and got no takers. At that point, you start sweetening the deal for giving up your seat until you get some takers. I guarantee it wouldn't have taken much.