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New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

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Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#81

Post by jerf »

ransom1538 wrote: post #71

So people on HN are pro employers posting their employee salaries publicly but against previous companies asking what their salaries are. WTF. I must be missing something here. I personally believe your salary is your business. Period. Getting salary information bad, forcing employees to divulge salaries from a position of power is disgusting. Here is me being publicly quartered on HN for pushing back on forcing empl…

"So [some] people on HN are pro employers posting their employee salaries publicly but [some people on HN are] against previous companies asking what their salaries are. WTF. I must be missing something here."

I added some words to your quote in the square brackets that should resolve the confusion for you.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#82

Post by louisswiss »

pmoriarty wrote: post #43

I never answer questions about my past or expected salary, not to employers and not to recruiters. Most employers don't ask, and the few that have (perhaps by having a part of an employment form ask for previous salary) have never made my leaving that information out an issue. Most recruiters, if they even ask, respect my decision not to talk about it, but I've been pressed hard on this by a handful of recruiters, an…

Agree with you in principle (your previous deal with company A is absolutely none of company B's business) but I would like to challenge you on one point:

> I'm placed at a disadvantage in negotiations if I name a number first.

... This is unlikely to be true. Generally, in price negotiations it is advantageous to name a number first. This is known as anchoring and basically the theory is that the end result is better for you if the company has to wheedle you down from 170k than if they anchor the price at 100k and you have to argue them up from there.

Plus, it saves a lot of wasted negotiation time on both sides if your price is just way too high for the company and this is clear from the beginning.

(edit: I'm talking about expected salary in general, not disclosing your current salary level)

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#83

Post by ingenuous2 »

nommm-nommm wrote: post #27
paulcole wrote: post #4

Good. Not enough people realize the best way to answer this question is with a straight-up lie.

Careful!! There's quite a few ways to verify past salary. Specially some employers report employment information to private databases and your potential employer runs a "employment report," like banks run a credit report, as part of a mandatory background check. To see if you lied. Of course, they can't do that without your permission but agreeing to a background check is a condition of employment. The database i am…

My preferred technique is to mentally baseline my current total comp, then shoot for that as my base at my next position.

You really shouldn't compare salaries, since benefits can vary so much.

So if I'm making $100k in base now, but have a good bonus structure, a good vacation package, health, retirement, etc., could make that total comp closer to $150. So that's what I say is my current compensation -- most people will anchor to that in salary negotiations.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#84

Post by eru »

maxxxxx wrote: post #18
xyzzy4 wrote: post #5

This is bad for the free market and freedom of speech. I hope it gets challenged on First Amendment grounds.

I see my past salaries as trade secret of my business. So it's good that I can protect this secret.

People can ask about trade secrets just fine. It's just that you don't have to answer.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#85

Post by AlwaysRock »

I'm not sure how effective this will be. When I was recruiting It got to the point where I would never ask salary's I would just say, "I'm assume your currently making between XXk and XXk?" and 9 times out of 10 I was in the right range. 1 time out of 10 they would say no and correct me. I just took a educated guess based on knowing the market. Any good recruiter should be able to do the same.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#86

Post by jakob223 »

ransom1538 wrote: post #71

So people on HN are pro employers posting their employee salaries publicly but against previous companies asking what their salaries are. WTF. I must be missing something here. I personally believe your salary is your business. Period. Getting salary information bad, forcing employees to divulge salaries from a position of power is disgusting. Here is me being publicly quartered on HN for pushing back on forcing empl…

I'm confused by why these things are so connected for you; I think it benefits potential employees to both not have to talk about past salaries and to be able to know what other employees are being paid.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#87

Post by snarf21 »

southphillyman wrote: post #41

They are trying to pass this in Philadelphia in May. Comcast and the local Chamber of Commerce are suing to stop it citing that it's a Freedom of Speech violation. Besides being able to freely low ball candidates who started behind the 8 ball (women/minorities/people who didn't go to elite schools), is there a real argument for companies HAVING to know your previous salary?

This is a very contentious subject. There has to be a negotiation at some point and employees have to share what they are willing to accept and the employer has to share what they are willing to pay. There is some validity to the idea that an employee is worth whatever they can get an employer to pay them, so their previous salary is an indication or ballpark of what that amount might be.

I think a less infringing question is for the employer to ask for the salary the employee is expecting. Then there is no lying and the employee can try for a 20% jump or more and see what happens. They can also just ask for the employer's offer but in practice the employer is going to go up slowly and find the lowest salary they would take anyway.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#88

Post by karrotwaltz »

comicjk wrote: post #36
paulcole wrote: post #4

Good. Not enough people realize the best way to answer this question is with a straight-up lie.

This points to an interesting method of poverty reduction - identify the little tricks which knowledgeable people use to get ahead in the system, and tweak the system to make the tricks less necessary.

Also, I think salary negotiation is partially responsible for the man / woman wage gap.

I think men are more inclined to agressive negotiate their salaries, and women might be less prone to lie or hide their current salary too.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#89

Post by nommm-nommm »

matwood wrote: post #62
nommm-nommm wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Careful!! There's quite a few ways to verify past salary. Specially some employers report employment information to private databases and your potential employer runs a "employment report," like banks run a credit report, as part of a mandatory background check. To see if you lied. Of course, they can't do that without your permission but agreeing to a background check is a condition of employment. The database i am…

That's why you just say "around" and add 20% to your current salary. And even if a company does find out, who cares? What I made at a prior job has zero bearing on my next job. If the new company thinks I bring in enough value to be paid X, then they paying X should be fine.

Who cares? There's a -huge- difference between dodging the question with a vague answer, defecting, or refusing to answer and -outright lying- about your previous salary! These reports are run to catch lying. Do the former, don't outright lie.

Similarly, I know part of my job when I do an interview is to sell the company and the position. So I'll put a positive spin on things but I won't outright lie.

Re: New York City bans employers from asking potential workers about past salary

#90

Post by literallycancer »

Double_a_92 wrote: post #32
davexunit wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The free market is trash. Employers must be regulated.

Worker Unions should do that, not the state.

Just think of the state as a more inclusive union.
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