Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue • Hacker News Board

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#361

Post by vertex-four » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 4:40 PM UTC

sathackr wrote: post #319

lliiffee wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're making the argument that with more guns, countries tend to have fewer gun deaths per gun. This makes sense, casually. However, I doubt that anyone cares about the number of gun murders per gun, but rather the total number of gun murders, which is (please correct me if wrong) still correlated with more guns. Also, I see that you've focused the discussion on gun murders, which is fine, but we should note…

Does it matter what weapon the murder/suicide was committed with? Yes, fewer guns mean fewer gun deaths -- but does it mean fewer deaths in general? If fewer people own Honda Civics, then fewer people will die in Honda Civic accidents. But that dip in Honda Civic deaths would likely be absorbed into deaths by all other car models, such that the overall death rate remains the same.

Not if it's easier (psychologically, practically, whatever) to kill someone with a Honda Civic than other cars, of course.

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#362

Post by MaxfordAndSons » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 4:43 PM UTC

HillaryBriss wrote: post #333

briandear wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mexican gun control laws are far stricter than anything in Europe. You can get years in prison for even a single unauthorized bullet. Mexico is a case study of how gun control can lead to an increase in danger for the population. Gun control can be nice in "civilized" places, but in Mexico, even the police are on the take. Justice in Mexico consists of avoiding the "Justice System" at all costs. I lived a year in Cha…

> the cartels are among the Church's biggest benefactors i'd like to hear more about this. this story does not receive a lot of coverage in the US.

I can't speak on the relationship between the Church and the cartels specifically, but many of the wealthiest narcos are significant social benefactors in their home regions. It's a brilliant strategy - it legitimizes their organization in the eyes of the citizenry, by addressing real needs that the state has failed to fulfill, and in so doing simultaneously delegitimizes the state.

For example in Sinaloa, El Chapo's home state, he's regarded by many as a "Robin Hood" figure because he's built schools, churches, hospitals and more in impoverished mountain villages that receive little to no aid from the state. In return, he was for years able to move freely and conduct his business with impunity from Sinaloa, without having to worry about locals betraying him.

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#363

Post by mter » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 4:46 PM UTC

mattmanser wrote: post #262

diamondo25 wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Living in the Netherlands, I know that people with bad intentions most likely have guns. Even in my small hometown, a citizen that owned a spy equipment store got shot up in daylight in front of his home. Other example would be people getting robbed in their house with guns (not daily, but it happens). There are plenty of other examples... I cannot say I feel 100% save most of the time.

It might not make you feel better, but Holland's gun death per 100,000 is in the 0.5's compared to the U.S.'s 10's and Mexico's 10's. You're 20 times more likely to get killed by a gun in the US or Mexico. Note that in the whole of Holland there are 50 gun homicides per year, so you were actually pretty unlucky to experience that. Your experience is exceptional and not a common occurrence, especially as I assume most…

> You're 20 times more likely to get killed by a gun in the US

This is very misleading because this audience is primarily middle class/rich white/asians employed in the tech industry.

There are 2 primary factors in homicide rates. Be poor or be a certain race. If you are not either of those things, your chances of being murdered in the US is very low.

*edit 3 factors -- men. Women don't get murdered often.

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#364

Post by TenOhms » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 4:46 PM UTC

briandear wrote: post #292

mattmanser wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might not make you feel better, but Holland's gun death per 100,000 is in the 0.5's compared to the U.S.'s 10's and Mexico's 10's. You're 20 times more likely to get killed by a gun in the US or Mexico. Note that in the whole of Holland there are 50 gun homicides per year, so you were actually pretty unlucky to experience that. Your experience is exceptional and not a common occurrence, especially as I assume most…

The gun homicide rate in the US is 4.5. The US has roughly 110 guns per 100,000 people and 4.5 gun homicides per 100,000 people. Mexico has over 20 gun homicides per 100,000 people and about 18 guns per 100,000 people. Canada has 2 gun murders per 100,000 people and 31 guns per 100,000 people. Mexico: each gun is responsible for 1.11 murders US: each gun is responsible for .04 murders Canada: each gun is responsible…

Guns are a solution in the right hands, that's what the founders believed, and if these stats are correct it proves that they can be used responsibly if society is stable enough. I think we're approaching a time though when guns will be a net negative, but by then, the USA will cease to exist as we know it today.

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#365

Post by darkcube » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 4:54 PM UTC

realusername wrote: post #250

Cyph0n wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, their human rights track record is terrible, but even with that, Dubai is still safer than most other large cities. What do you mean by "tourists"? Did you miss the part where I say that I lived in the UAE for 14 years?

You are probably not an Indian construction worker.

...or a woman

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#366

Post by avar » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 5:10 PM UTC

lorenzhs wrote: post #352

avar wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As another resident of Amsterdam. I don't think your impression of the situation really matches up with statistics. Look at these two articles: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-r... http://projects.oregonlive.com/ucc-shooting/gun-deaths Here you can see the gun death rate in The Netherlands per 100k inhabitants is 0.58, but there's some areas in the US where the rate is quite comparable. Wha…

I'm sorry, but the lowest group for that US graphic you linked is higher than the number of the Netherlands (0.58 gun deaths, 0.29 of which are homicides, both per 100k). The lowest groups are 2-7 and 0.5-1.4, respectively, both of which are significantly higher than the value for the Netherlands. In fact, your link shows the exact opposite of what you claim: there isn't a single county in the US that has lower gun d…

You're misreading the graph[1]. The 2-7 grouping is all gun deaths, homicides, suicides, and accidental deaths.

If you hover over individual blue counties you can see the breakdown by homicide and suicide rate for some of them.

E.g. Washington, NY has a gun homicide rate of 0.46, gun suicide rate of 5.14. Meanwhile The Netherlands has a gun homicide rate of 0.29, gun suicide rate of 0.28, but an overall homicide rate of 0.7[2], and an overall suicide rate of 8.2, while the US has a suicide rate of 12.1.

Does The Netherlands still come out better? Am I cherry-picking by comparing county-level statistics v.s. entire countries? Yes and yes.

But for the point I'm making it doesn't matter. The point is that there's a common misunderstanding, particularly among mainland Europeans, that the mere availability of guns in the US results in a drastic increase in the homicide rate.

This is simply not supported by the data. What the data does show is that if you're going to kill yourself or others you're likely to use the best tool for the task, whether that's a gun or a knife.

Does the ease of availability of guns in the US make it easier to kill people, and cause some murders that otherwise wouldn't have happened? Yeah, but it's hard to tease that out of the data, it also prevents some murders.

What we do see from the data[2] is that there's lots of countries with much more restrictive gun policies that have higher homicide rates than the US, and furthermore the occurrences of gun-related homicides in the US don't at all map to whether the area has more liberal access to guns, but whether there's a general crime & poverty problem there.

Lithuania has a significantly higher homicide rate than the US, 5.5 v.s. the US's 3.9, but just 1% of homicides there are gun crimes[3].

However I've never heard anyone say to my Lithuanian friends that they were lucky to get out because of the obscene murder rate there, but I've heard my fellow Europeans make comments like that to some of my American friends when it comes to gun crimes.

1. http://projects.oregonlive.com/ucc-shooting/gun-deaths

2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intention...

3. https://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/citation/quotes/10319

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#367

Post by quirkafleeg » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 5:12 PM UTC

samstave wrote: post #327

diamondo25 wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Living in the Netherlands, I know that people with bad intentions most likely have guns. Even in my small hometown, a citizen that owned a spy equipment store got shot up in daylight in front of his home. Other example would be people getting robbed in their house with guns (not daily, but it happens). There are plenty of other examples... I cannot say I feel 100% save most of the time.

that sounds like an interesting story - more info on the spy equipment store owner who was gunned down please. mayhaps it was a husband who was caught doing bad things by his wife, due to the spy equipment the guy sold to his wife?

Can't be that many spy shop related assassinations in NL, so probably this guy, Ronald Bakker.

http://nltimes.nl/2015/09/10/police-huizen-murder-gangland-a...

A search on his name brings up Dutch results that badly Google translate into English, but it seems (from what I can decipher from a translation) police suspect he may have been shot after being suspected of passing on info related to another criminal investigation.

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#368

Post by samstave » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 5:18 PM UTC

quirkafleeg wrote: post #367

samstave wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that sounds like an interesting story - more info on the spy equipment store owner who was gunned down please. mayhaps it was a husband who was caught doing bad things by his wife, due to the spy equipment the guy sold to his wife?

Can't be that many spy shop related assassinations in NL, so probably this guy, Ronald Bakker. http://nltimes.nl/2015/09/10/police-huizen-murder-gangland-a... A search on his name brings up Dutch results that badly Google translate into English, but it seems (from what I can decipher from a translation) police suspect he may have been shot after being suspected of passing on info related to another criminal investiga…

I think I am going to start investing in "Spy Shop Related Assassinations" - just because I like the way that phrase sounds...

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#369

Post by shados » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 5:18 PM UTC

magic_beans wrote: post #341

_delirium wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the Bronx, about half of Queens, about 1/3 of Brooklyn. Manhattan is mostly gentrified these days, with only a handful of exceptions. Staten Island is odd b/c it is barely walkable to begin with, so it's neither safe nor dangerous to walk.

To be fair, unless you live in the hood in the Bronx or Brooklyn, why would you be walking around alone at night anyway? Also... in which parts of Queens did you feel unsafe? Queens is actually quite safe.

Everything is relative to what you're used to I guess. I'm from a Canadian suburb, where a 16 years old girl who got attacked in a dark alley at 3:30 am while alone made the news for 3 months because that was the worse thing that had happened in decades.

Now I'm in Boston, in a heavily gentrified area, and I'm scared shitless after 11 pm. People all tell me it's a super safe area, but I know a few people who got mugged a few blocks away in various occasions.

Maybe it's just bad luck. Maybe compared to other areas, a few people getting their backpack stolen is nothing. But feelings are not always rationals. I don't feel safe here.

Re: Mexican Newspaper Shuts Down, Saying It Is Too Dangerous to Continue

#370

Post by komali2 » Tue, Apr 04, 2017, 5:34 PM UTC

seppin wrote: post #181

komali2 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure? Any American that's written something controversial inevitably will tell the story of the death threats they received after. JK Rowling got them for writing about child wizards. Planned Parenthood supporters get them. Trump electors have gotten them. Kim Kardashian (ugh) got them for a tweet supporting Israel. It's easy to find lists of Americans that have received death threats, but much harder to find…

> but much harder to find Americans actually killed because of their silly posts can you name one?

>Would love to read more about it.