Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

axios.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 65 posts

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#51

Post by Apocryphon »

bluebknight wrote: post #38
dudul wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question, no sarcasm: what is used as a clear and measurable distinction between a software developer and a software engineer?

Too many uninformed people spreading misinformation. There's clear and measurable difference between a software engineering degree and the one you get from a boot camp. It's exactly as strict and rigorous as you'd expect from a degree in mechanical engineering. In Canada, you get an iron ring when you graduate and after about 4 years, you get a professional engineering license.

Sure, but unfortunately in America that distinction does not exist as there is no rigorous industry-wide standardization process.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#52

Post by mikeryan »

cldellow wrote: post #8

This calibre of journalism feels like clickbait or, worse, incompetence. > computer programmers are no longer presumed to be eligible for H-1B visas. This is narrowly true based on what the linked document says. But the intent of document seems to be to rescind old guidance that would consider people with associate's degrees, or in some cases, no degrees, experts. That made sense in the 90s when CS was a newer field…

this is narrowly true based on what the linked document says. But the intent of document seems to be to rescind old guidance that would consider people with associate's degrees, or in some cases, no degrees, experts. That made sense in the 90s when CS was a newer field of study. It doesn't make sense now.

This statement only would apply to newer/younger applicants. The world is awash with engineers in their late 30s and above who may not have any sort of CS degree - or who's CS degrees would be fairly obsolete at this point who are excellent software engineers. I know a bunch.

That doesn't even begin to include the large number of folks I know from less fortunate countries who didn't have the opportunities to go to college but have managed to become excellent engineers regardless.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#53

Post by vickychijwani »

i0exception wrote: post #5
mavelikara wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't quite understand the memorandum [1] yet either, but it does say [2]: the fact that a person may be employed as a computer programmer and may use information technology skills and knowledge to help an enterprise achieve its goals in the course of his or her job is not sufficient to establish the position as a specialty occupation. So, calling the thesis of the article "absurd and incorrect" is probably too ear…

[IANAL] New guidelines as to what constitutes as a speciality occupation are already in place at the other centers handling H-1B applications. The only thing this memo is saying is "Hey, someone issued you folks a memorandum in December 2000 that shouldn't be used anymore because things have changed. We're rescinding it so that no one uses it accidentally"

Moreover, if USCIS thought this would affect already-filed applications, I think they would've made a clear blog post stating it as opposed to dumping it in a hard-to-read memorandum. (I'm subscribed to their newsletter which I've observed sends out all pertinent news with no delays).

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#54

Post by davidw »

takeda wrote: post #39
inputcoffee wrote: post #9

I wish there was a way to distinguish the quality of a worker from the degrees of a worker. Its not just that one wants a "computer technology worker", but one wants an individual who can communicate, work hard when needed, take on responsibility, easily read and comprehend instructions and so on. These are weakly correlated with degrees or how technical a field of study is. An art history undergrad could easily disp…

If we are looking for criteria in regards to H1B visas, I think it makes most sense to instead of having a lottery to pick up candidates, the criteria should be which candidates will get higher salary. By putting a price on a candidate, companies can then decide how valuable a given person is to them and let free market decide who gets the visa. This has several advantages, it allows sponsoring truly qualified candid…

This is predicated on a magic number of H1-B visas, an idea which is pretty absurd.

http://johnhcochrane.blogspot.com/2014/06/the-optimal-number...

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#55

Post by gojri »

takeda wrote: post #39
inputcoffee wrote: post #9

I wish there was a way to distinguish the quality of a worker from the degrees of a worker. Its not just that one wants a "computer technology worker", but one wants an individual who can communicate, work hard when needed, take on responsibility, easily read and comprehend instructions and so on. These are weakly correlated with degrees or how technical a field of study is. An art history undergrad could easily disp…

If we are looking for criteria in regards to H1B visas, I think it makes most sense to instead of having a lottery to pick up candidates, the criteria should be which candidates will get higher salary. By putting a price on a candidate, companies can then decide how valuable a given person is to them and let free market decide who gets the visa. This has several advantages, it allows sponsoring truly qualified candid…

In any selection framework involving a salary cap, salary comparisons should be normalized for geographic location for a fairer comparison. For example, have some kind of a formula that provides a multiplier for each state, derived using median wage data, cost of living, etc.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#56

Post by dirtybird04 »

inputcoffee wrote: post #9

I wish there was a way to distinguish the quality of a worker from the degrees of a worker. Its not just that one wants a "computer technology worker", but one wants an individual who can communicate, work hard when needed, take on responsibility, easily read and comprehend instructions and so on. These are weakly correlated with degrees or how technical a field of study is. An art history undergrad could easily disp…

It's really not that hard, Canada seems to have it figured out. You get points for job offer, education, experience, language, and family. If you graduate from a Canadian school, you get an open work-permit, not tied to any employer. Fast path to naturalization. Pretty good system imo.

US has never really had a proper immigration program for graduates and skilled workers. H1B is a hackjob, and has outlived its usefulness. Makes no sense that a MIT undergrad is given the same preference as a call-center worker. Sure get rid of H1B, but the problems will still be there if you don't come up with a serious alternative for graduates and skilled workers.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#57

Post by johngreglewis »

Why limit the discussion only to H1B visas? Companies such as Citigroup use external contractors such as First Derivatives to hire thousands of workers on E2 Investor visas. These immigrants displace US workers earning a much higher wage. E2 visas have no salary cap. So my colleague earning $120,000 was replaced by a Citibank E2 visa holder earning $30,000. This is unfair to US citizens that pay their fair taxes and a misuse of the Investor visa scheme.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#58

Post by johngreglewis »

Why limit the discussion only to H1B visas? Companies such as Citigroup use external contractors such as First Derivatives to hire thousands of workers on E2 Investor visas. These immigrants displace US workers earning a much higher wage. E2 visas have no salary cap. So my colleague earning $120,000 was replaced by a Citibank E2 visa holder earning $30,000. This is unfair to US citizens that pay their fair taxes and a misuse of the Investor visa scheme.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#59

Post by throwaway71958 »

gojri wrote: post #55
takeda wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we are looking for criteria in regards to H1B visas, I think it makes most sense to instead of having a lottery to pick up candidates, the criteria should be which candidates will get higher salary. By putting a price on a candidate, companies can then decide how valuable a given person is to them and let free market decide who gets the visa. This has several advantages, it allows sponsoring truly qualified candid…

In any selection framework involving a salary cap, salary comparisons should be normalized for geographic location for a fairer comparison. For example, have some kind of a formula that provides a multiplier for each state, derived using median wage data, cost of living, etc.

>> should be normalized for geographic location

No it shouldn't. Top N thousand by salary should be admitted, the rest -- rejected. How are you going to enforce your "geographic location" once the worker is here? We can't even enforce our borders let alone movement of people once they're in the country.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#60

Post by comments_db »

dirtybird04 wrote: post #56
inputcoffee wrote: post #9

I wish there was a way to distinguish the quality of a worker from the degrees of a worker. Its not just that one wants a "computer technology worker", but one wants an individual who can communicate, work hard when needed, take on responsibility, easily read and comprehend instructions and so on. These are weakly correlated with degrees or how technical a field of study is. An art history undergrad could easily disp…

It's really not that hard, Canada seems to have it figured out. You get points for job offer, education, experience, language, and family. If you graduate from a Canadian school, you get an open work-permit, not tied to any employer. Fast path to naturalization. Pretty good system imo. US has never really had a proper immigration program for graduates and skilled workers. H1B is a hackjob, and has outlived its useful…

Yes, absolutely yes. Why can't you have point system for US vs non-US schools, language skills, job history, offers, international/national/regional awards/publications, patents (of course). It's not that difficult if you really want to. But let's be honest, doing so would polarize most of the visas towards Europe, Japan, South Korea and BRICS countries. I don't think this is going to work for political reasons.
Post reply on HN