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Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

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Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#121

Post by criley2 »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #97
criley2 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The difference being that you can install or upgrade Windows on a system without buying a new laptop or requiring support from the vendor; the vendor doesn't lock down laptops to prevent upgrades and force people to buy a new device instead. As a poweruser, I have installed new versions of Windows AND new versions of Android. To the average user, neither is feasible. To a technical user, both are possible. I don't l…

I think there is a shocking difference here. Windows install is, for all compatible devices: 1. Insert install disc/USB. 2. Boot to install disc. 3. Spam the next button. Installing new Android OS versions manually often involves custom third party unlock tools from sketchy download sites.

And yet, if you ask a non-technical user to install a new OS, it's entirely likely they'll refuse, be uncomfortable with the implications of what they're doing, and if you do force them to do it, will be frustrated with the result.

I worked in a Computer Repair shop for years through college and believe me, the average user has ZERO interest in installing or re-installing an OS. They will pay >$100 to have someone "spam next a few times" as you put it.

I would call that a distinction without a difference. End result is the same: non-technical users do not do it.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#122

Post by bitmapbrother »

technofiend wrote: post #95
pjmlp wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they cared one second about it, they would have changed the terms of access to the Google services. The sad part is that the 2016 security report just came out and they brag how the whole security improved, without mentioning the elephant in the room. Google IO is around the corner and I bet they will keep talking as if everyone could upgrade right away to Android O, with N now having barely 2%.

And that even google-sourced devices have a very short lifecycle for OS and security updates. Google seem to be running under the assumption any phone over 12 months old is reaching the end of its usable life.

A Google device receives security updates for 36 months. Not sure where you pulled your 12 months from.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#123

Post by bitmapbrother »

pjmlp wrote: post #102
dublinben wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone (who buys Google phones) can upgrade right away. It's not Google's fault that the other manufacturers refuse to update their products in a timely manner. The responsibility for these devices lies solely with the manufacturer.

Surely it is their fault, because Google is the very first to give the example of selling devices more expensive than desktop computers, above the minimum wage in many countries, with updates limited to 2 years (+1 for some fixes). As for the other OEMs, there is this thing called contracts and legal obligations. No updates, no access to Google services from invalid devices. It is as easy as that, if Google actually…

Stop being disingenuous on purpose. A Google device receives security updates for 36 months. Your "+1 for some fixes" comment implies that you only get "some" of the security updates when, in fact, you get all of security updates.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#124

Post by gsnedders »

erickhill wrote: post #47

I've got to think this is the rise of internet/consumer purchasing power in Asia. When I look at the analytics at the company I work for, Android accounts for 9% of total users visiting the site. We are a US-based web company with a predominantly English-speaking user base. Windows still rules, followed by Mac and iOS (interestingly iOS is catching up with Mac and is nearly even). At a high level, Android seems to ha…

And Africa.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#125

Post by bitmapbrother »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #103
dublinben wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone (who buys Google phones) can upgrade right away. It's not Google's fault that the other manufacturers refuse to update their products in a timely manner. The responsibility for these devices lies solely with the manufacturer.

This excuse completely ignores the fact that through the MADA contract, Google controls all of the manufacturers and defines whether or not they are allowed to sell Android phones, effectively. And that the OS is designed, by Google, to require the manufacturer to distribute the update, rather than, as with... pretty much all other OSes, the software developer being responsible for updating their own software. Google…

Google does not control whether OEM's are allowed to sell Android phones. Does Google control the sale of all of those Chinese branded phones that don't ship with Google Play Services? Or how about the Blackphone or the Copperhead phone? The MADA simply states what is required if your phone wants to ship with Google Play Services and Apps.

>Google would like you to blame the manufacturer, but you need to realize the fact that you even can blame the manufacturer is a design flaw in the OS which Google designed.

This sentence makes so sense. Google cannot update an OS that they did not create. The OEM rolled the OS so only they can update it. How exactly does Google update an OS from an OEM they don't even have the source for? It's the OEM's responsibility and if that OEM doesn't do their job in updating their OS then maybe it's time to start looking for an OEM that does do their job.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#126

Post by bitmapbrother »

shp0ngle wrote: post #98
alnitak wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me ask a (potentially) very stupid question here: What prevents doing the same on phones? What would make a phone hardware able to install anything that compiles to its CPU architecture the same way a PC can?

I don't really understand it either. I get Windows security updates on every damn computer I buy. Yes, the computer is pre-loaded with bloat, but I still get updates like everyone else. Meanwhile, on Android, I mostly get nothing. What is so fundamentally different between PC and phone? Why is it so hard on mobile phones?

Does your OEM create their version of Windows? No, they ship the binaries they receive from Microsoft. As long as Android OEM's are allowed to build their own version of Android this problem will always be in the hands of the OEM.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#127

Post by cmurf »

_wmd wrote: post #25

I guess this means we can officially stop hating on Microsoft for having such a lax attitude towards security, considering their last OS to suffer from that attitude was released 16 years ago, and it accounts for less than 3% of present day traffic according to statcounter.com Meanwhile according to the same stats, Android sits around 37.9%, and I have to wonder just how many of those devices are still impacted by fo…

The gist is that Google wanted to grow Android into something other than a niche player, and made a deal with the devils: hardware vendors. In effect, hardware vendors said they wanted to take a dump on their customers just like they always have, with bloatware baked in and planned obsolescence and Google said OK. And they don't control the hardware.

On the manufacturing side, a huge team is assembled with piles of money and resources to design and build a complete product out of hardware, firmware (blobs), and software, test it, document it, and then hand it off to marketing. That entire team is disbanded into a pool from which a whole new team will be created for a whole new product. Maybe less than a dozen people remain on a product team following release, and that's just to cover major bugs found once it's in the field. After about 6 months, it might be a team of two people. If it's a small market product, it might be a team of handful that cover multiple similar products.

Anyway, after 18-24 months there's essentially no one around from the manufacturer to support the product. It's not at all the same business model as say, Apple, where it's a giant team supporting a dozen handsets post-release, with coordinated roll outs for bug fixes.

If you want a newer OS on the Android phone, it's a do it yourself proposition. Lineage OS. Hopefully your phone has a relatively easy to unlock bootloader. And while Lineage OS will have a much newer kernel than the stock OS, the code to support, e.g. the NFC, may not be upstream because it's got some patent encumbered code, or maybe something new in the kernel breaks some driver and no one is around who knows enough about it to get it fixed. The exact sequence to put components into low power state, if not correct can cause battery life to suck. There are all sorts of ways this can not work out well, but at least it's an option.

What Google has done since Android 5 is emphasize library stability and security through Google Play updates. New features and bug fixes happen via Google Play itself being updated; it appears to be just an app update but it's actually what the bulk of 3rd party apps use. The low level stuff including the kernel isn't user space, and while your handset gets stuck for life, in effect, with an old kernel, Google are pushing out a chunk of bug and security fixes this way.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#128

Post by bitmapbrother »

Someone1234 wrote: post #51
_wmd wrote: post #25

I guess this means we can officially stop hating on Microsoft for having such a lax attitude towards security, considering their last OS to suffer from that attitude was released 16 years ago, and it accounts for less than 3% of present day traffic according to statcounter.com Meanwhile according to the same stats, Android sits around 37.9%, and I have to wonder just how many of those devices are still impacted by fo…

The sad part is that these are issues with Android that Linux already solved. Google uses Linux within Android but instead of allowing the underlying parts to be updated via package management-like functionality, the kernel level stuff is only distributable as images in one "big bang" go. You could have a bug in a single binary at the kernel level, but instead of a tiny 1Kb diff patch you wait a year for a giant 1.2…

>You could have a bug in a single binary at the kernel level, but instead of a tiny 1Kb diff patch you wait a year for a giant 1.2 GB vendor update that also contains a lot of other changes you have no interest in.

Security patches are not 1+ GB in size - no where close to it. You're referring to OS updates that completely replace the old OS.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#129

Post by ferongr »

najati83 wrote: post #94
j_s wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting perspective. Where is this coming from, geographically? It doesn't match my experience here in North America.

Spain.

If your GSM network is anything like Greece's (and I don't doubt it is, grey market devices from Spain sold here work without issue), Android automatically sets up the network settings for MMS and wireless networking. You don't have to do anything.

Re: Android overtakes Windows as the internet’s most used operating system

#130

Post by [deleted] »

j_s wrote: post #88
najati83 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sending an MMS is very expensive and many people don't even bother to configure their mobiles to send them because they've never used them.

Interesting perspective. Where is this coming from, geographically? It doesn't match my experience here in North America.

[deleted]
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