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Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

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Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#71

Post by [deleted] »

ryanSrich wrote: post #56
huhtenberg wrote: post #21

Wasn't a problem with "bad" instant coffee largely solved by Starbucks VIA, which too utilizes a novel tech that produces very decent results? Even the mega snobs of /r/coffee were largely OK with it came out few years ago. Also, re: this - Instant coffee is liquid coffee that’s been dehydrated. It’s normally made with the worst beans ... Next, the liquid is boiled down and finally dehydrated by spray drying it with…

Every flight I've been on with Starbucks VIA has been absolute trash. Airplane coffee quite literally tastes like it was made with toilet water. That's honestly the only way I can describe it. I'm bearish on any improvements because I'm convinced the problem is the water they use.

[deleted]

Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#73

Post by aquilaFiera »

dragonwriter wrote: post #54
aquilaFiera wrote: post #17

I've been a subscriber for Sudden Coffee since Christmas and I love it. The coffee is definitely as good the corner cafe here in San Francisco. I love it because it takes me 1/10 the time to make a great cup of coffee in the morning. I just upped my subscription so I can get more every month. On top of that the customer service has been top notch so far with Kalle himself answering my questions. My initial worry was…

> The coffee is definitely as good the corner cafe here in San Francisco. I've only tried a few since I don't even live in SF, but IME "as good [as] the corner cafe here in San Francisco" could be anywhere from horrible to excellent, depending on the particular corner cafe.

Okay, fair. I'm from Salt Lake City where the coffee is decidedly not as good. What I meant to say it's as good to me as Philz.

Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#74

Post by freese »

yomly wrote: post #13

This is super interesting! I had always assumed coffee was made via liophilization at scale, any insight on why it's not? On the subject of extraction, how are you measuring yield? What are the main differences in the 40% coffee yield you're leaving on the table?

In normal conditions you can only extract up to ≈30% of the coffee beans mass, ie. no matter how fine you grind and long you brew you'll only get 30%. The rest are insoluble solids: cellulose so basically wood.

When the big boys brew the coffee in really high temp and pressure (165-190C, 15 bars) the structure of the bean changes and previously insoluble parts of the hemicellulose become soluble. This means you get a higher yield but what you get are nasty, woody, heavy bitter compounds.

Here's a diagram explaining more: https://goo.gl/dJTsxM

Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#75

Post by freese »

ctb9 wrote: post #65
toss1941 wrote: post #8

Does anyone know how this compares to Starbucks Via?

I do. I met one of the founders about six months ago and got a single serving to try (before they started using the tubes). A couple weeks ago I compared it head to head against starbucks Via while backpacking. Sudden Coffee totally blew Starbucks Via away. It's about as much better than Via as Via is compared to the horrible Nestle stuff. It's not going to replace my daily pourover, but for future camping trips I'll…

Thanks for the comment! Totally agree with you.

Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#76

Post by zloof »

huhtenberg wrote: post #21

Wasn't a problem with "bad" instant coffee largely solved by Starbucks VIA, which too utilizes a novel tech that produces very decent results? Even the mega snobs of /r/coffee were largely OK with it came out few years ago. Also, re: this - Instant coffee is liquid coffee that’s been dehydrated. It’s normally made with the worst beans ... Next, the liquid is boiled down and finally dehydrated by spray drying it with…

So I'd say look at it like a spectrum. In the cafe world there is - average/ not-so-great drip coffee --> Starbucks --> Speciality/ Third Wave Coffee.

I don't know how VIA makes their product, but if you do a side-by-side taste test with Sudden vs VIA, I 100% guarantee you will notice (and prefer) Sudden. We do in fact use a pretty unique bean selection + brewing process to achieve it.

Re: drying techniques - it really varies brand by brand and when you go to a store shelf in the US, most of the brands you see are spray dried, not freeze dried. In the US, you specifically have to look for brands that say 'freeze dried' and it's usually reserved for the more expensive instant coffees. Spray drying is much cheaper, but yields a lower quality product. Freeze dried coffee is a lot more common outside of the US. Even within freeze drying - we use a smaller batch freeze drying process. I've worked in large scale manufacturing before and with a smaller batch process we are able to achieve much higher quality levels.

Re: beans - most coffee beans bought and sold are bought as a commodity product - think rice, beans, etc. They can literally be years old before being brewed. We have seen lots of these beans and they visibly have mold and insect damage. The beans we use are hand-picked when ripe. Much closer to picking grapes from a vineyard.

Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#78

Post by freese »

gingerbread-man wrote: post #70
ryanSrich wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every flight I've been on with Starbucks VIA has been absolute trash. Airplane coffee quite literally tastes like it was made with toilet water. That's honestly the only way I can describe it. I'm bearish on any improvements because I'm convinced the problem is the water they use.

You're spot on re: the water quality. An investigation at DFW a few years ago found hazardous levels of e.coli in the potable water tanks used to refill aircraft. I wonder why the airlines aren't doing anything about this. I'm not a frequent first-class passenger, but if I were, high-quality coffee would be a big deal for me.

Plane water is really nasty. Even Sudden made it will not taste great. You can mix Sudden with cold water by shaking it in a bottle and that's what I usually do when traveling

Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#79

Post by danielvinson »

zloof wrote: post #32
rhaps0dy wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What prevents you from subscribing and then unsubscribing just afterwards? (I don't know, maybe the webpage does, but there's no mention of minimum times anywhere and recurringcheckout has let me unsubscribe without problems in the past)

Nothing prevents you from doing this and you are totally welcome to do it! You can email our support email as well and we'll cancel it for you. We'd obviously prefer that you stay on with a subscription, but are just happy to have more people give us a try.

This is enough of a hassle that I will never make the purchase, despite being interested.

Re: Launch HN: Sudden Coffee (YC W17) – Instant coffee that doesn't suck

#80

Post by zloof »

dragonwriter wrote: post #54
aquilaFiera wrote: post #17

I've been a subscriber for Sudden Coffee since Christmas and I love it. The coffee is definitely as good the corner cafe here in San Francisco. I love it because it takes me 1/10 the time to make a great cup of coffee in the morning. I just upped my subscription so I can get more every month. On top of that the customer service has been top notch so far with Kalle himself answering my questions. My initial worry was…

> The coffee is definitely as good the corner cafe here in San Francisco. I've only tried a few since I don't even live in SF, but IME "as good [as] the corner cafe here in San Francisco" could be anywhere from horrible to excellent, depending on the particular corner cafe.

We aren't going to beat out the best of the best cafes with trained baristas, but we will definitely beat out the average corner cafe (where people often spend $3-4 on a coffee).
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