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Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

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Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#491

Post by darpa_escapee »

researcher11 wrote: post #224
Johnny555 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I promise if you plan it out it's completely possible to retire with dignity and people are doing it all the time Unless, of course your planning counts on government sponsored health insurance or even Social Security since in today's political climate, there's no guarantee that either will be around for your retirement.

Pensions are the first to go. They already are in many places. Taxpayers will be unable to bail them out. If you think being 20 with a shitty job is bad then consider being 65 with no savings or income whatsoever.

> being 65 with no savings or income whatsoever.

I'm watching this happen to my own and friends' parents. Pensions gutted in industries / jobs that are dying or dead and nest eggs drying up very quickly to pay for health insurance and living costs. Most of these people did everything "right" that was within their means when it came to planning ahead and they are fucked.

If they were in an even lower economic rung of society, I would imagine what they are experiencing would be much worse. As in homelessness, malnutrition and death from easily treatable illnesses.

This is not something anyone wants for their future.

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#492

Post by guskel »

sheepmullet wrote: post #63
ocschwar wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what scares the shit of me regarding UBI. I don't mind paying for it even if it does keep young men immersed in a fantasy world. But I have a daughter. And she will be surrounded by men whose idea of women will be shaped by game characters that fail the Turing test but have big tits. I guess for her first birthday after puberty I'll have to get her a taser.

I think you might be worrying about the wrong thing. Young men have much healthier views on gender equality than when I was young. The trend I see is young men not putting in the effort to form romantic relationships and young women, rather than adjust their standards or put more effort in, trying to compete for the few guys who do measure up. I would be much more worried that my daughter was going to end up very lon…

Why do only men have to lower their standards? From what I see amongst my peers, the guys have lower standards than women do. These aren't guys who don't "put more effort in" either.

See Tinder for example. Most guys have a hard enough time getting matches but one male-model looking guy can easily have hundreds. The modern dating reality for men is winner-take-all.

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#493

Post by douche »

deegles wrote: post #416
pjc50 wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That assumes that the person has opportunities they're giving up. If they don't have them, or can't see that they have them, it's not nearly so expensive to them. (Belief that you have opportunities, and motivation to take them, is very valuable. You can't just tell people this though, humans don't work like that)

This is one of the reasons I believe basic income won't result in masses of people 'dropping out' of society. People will seek real fulfillment given the resources.

I'm afraid people will just drop out and get high. That's what people on disability or social security are doing now.

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#494

Post by douche »

lacampbell wrote: post #326
api wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been predicting "planet Japan" for years due to slowing population growth, resource constraints, and market saturation.

Well at least I can look forward to better customer service and lower crime rates.

You need to have the cultural homogeneity for that.

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#495

Post by astrodust »

flukus wrote: post #143
astrodust wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is what happened in Japan in the mid 1990s when it firmly entered the post-industrial age. There's an entire sector of society that's given up on getting ahead because the old model of employment is broken, and there's no point in fighting to get ahead since there's no winning. Console games and ramen noodles until you die.

It seems like there's a limit to growth and Japan were just the first ones to hit the limit. Everyone else has just cheated the limit with "artificial growth" via immigration.

You might be right about that. Japan has been pretty hostile to immigration, so it's probable that's a significant factor here.

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#496

Post by yummyfajitas »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #378
yummyfajitas wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This flies flatly in the face of a sublinear utility to income relationship. It does no such thing. Will you put in an extra 20 hours for a 30% raise? How about 30 hours for a 45% raise? Sublinear utility merely means that there is some point at which you'll stop. I wonder if there'd be a significant gender split in how a UBI acts as a [dis]incentive to work. In the Mincome experiment, which resulted in a 10% decreas…

> It does no such thing. Will you put in an extra 20 hours for a 30% raise? How about 30 hours for a 45% raise? By that point you're just running into the superlinear cost of time. Easy demonstration: What about an extra 130 hours for 195%? 40 + 130 > 168, so that's literally impossible. 120 would be possible but you would die of sleep deprivation. Even if the value of money is linear or superlinear, the value of tim…

majority of the decrease was from young mothers and students.

Let me repeat: "However given that the original data/study is unavailable (merely news reports about it), it's impossible to know if that effect was significant. (Back in the day they weren't as good at multiple comparisons corrections as they are now.)"

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#497

Post by yummyfajitas »

chongli wrote: post #366
yummyfajitas wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is this the presumed scenario? That is not the scenario here in India, where the lower class does in fact work as domestic labor for the middle class. Starvation only seems to happen nowadays in war zones and communist countries.

Starvation is not the motivator I would suggest. Just curious, have you taken a look at the comments section on YouTube? There's an ENORMOUS amount of hate being tossed around and I would conjecture that it is coming from the cheeseburger gamer cohort (and their employed gamer allies). This hate is being directed at anyone who appears to be doing better than they are of late: women, minorities, Jews, middle and upper…

So we should pay the Nazis not to harm innocent Jews? Can I also get paid for starting a nationalist movement and threatening innocents?

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#498

Post by marknutter »

nommm-nommm wrote: post #474
marknutter wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a massive shortage of long haul truckers right now. Industry turnover is at 100%. When was your family doing it? I know of quite a few places here in Minnesota that are offering $70k with a $10-20k signing bonus and still having a hell of a time retaining drivers.

Right now and in the past. If the job was so high paid and cushy then why would there be 100% turnover? And 100%? You believe there's literally nobody who is a trucker for more than a year? You are not making any sense. "Pay for truckers varies by distance and employer. Glassdoor estimates median pay for truckers drivers -- mostly long haul drivers -- is $54,000. The American Trucking Association says that truckers w…

You are right, I was wrong about it being "minimum". $54k is still an absurdly high salary for any entry level employee, so my original point about there being plenty of jobs out there still stands.

And I know that turnover rate sounds absurd, but it's really that bad: https://www.forbes.com/sites/maryjosephs/2016/01/06/100-driv...

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#499

Post by dang »

wozer wrote: post #333
researcher11 wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is so perfectly stereotypical and dicorced from reality part of me thought it was a joke.

Hey rustynails: you seem to be shadowbanned.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13654730

Re: Young men dropping out of the job market to spend time in an alternate reality

#500

Post by dang »

edblarney wrote: post #440
alphonsegaston wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, here's one. The boomer's coasted on the tail end of a rising post-war economy and government largesse, then burned the ladder behind them and destroyed their legacy by electing Reagan. By any measure (college financing, wages, home prices) they were ridiculously advantaged relative to young people today, who now have to suffer under an obscenely priced regime of credentialism, largely administered (for their ow…

"The boomer's coasted on the tail end of a rising post-war economy and government largesse, then burned the ladder behind them and destroyed their legacy by electing Reagan. " Utter bullshit. It's not even anectodal - it's just complete narrative fiction. This is HN, try some facts. Which material or social elements regarding standard of living between the generations, implies that 'Millenials have it harder'? By eve…

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