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What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

newhumanist.org.uk

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Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#81

Post by qplex »

anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

Consume less. Don't buy useless things. Don't drive a car. Don't fly. Buy your electricity from a sustainable source. Eat less meat.

Try to get other people to do the same.

I find it's hard to do most of these things, and I don't really have much hope that people will change their habits.

Most people don't even realise that they live in an illusion of reality where "everything is possible, you just have try hard enough".

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#82

Post by danvdragos »

masklinn wrote: post #66
danvdragos wrote: post #42

Reading this struck me: What is the difference between primordial volcanoes and human pollution? During the dinosaur age it was a lot hotter [0] and there were really extraordinary organisms. Further reading seems to go down a rabbit hole [1],etc. [0] http://blogs.ei.columbia.edu/2014/07/11/what-geology-has-to-... [1] https://www.theguardian.com/environment/blog/2010/apr/21/ice...

> During the dinosaur age it was a lot hotter [0] and there were really extraordinary organisms. 1. there were also no humans, we evolved during a relatively dry and cold period and for the most part that's what we (and our current globe-spanning civilisation) are adapted for. That's also very convenient as heat and humidity are parasite havens. 2. the second issue is rate of change , globe-spanning temperature chang…

Interesting... We need more oxygen than reptiles because we are 4 to 6 times less efficient in turning food to energy [0]

[0]http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2005/09/breathing-easier-jura...

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#83

Post by anotherturn »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #77
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

I see people mentioning things like "become a vegetarian" or "bike to work", but those are easy and neglible-impact things. Sure, they'd have a huge effect if half of the population suddenly adopted them, but that's not going to happen - so just going vegetarian yourself and calling it a day is not really helping anything. What I'd love to see is a list of high-impact work one could use their skills to help with. May…

This is exactly what I was thinking, though clearly failed to communicate. I already do a number of the things mentioned but I feel like it makes very little, if any difference.

From the comments below I've stared thinking of some things I can do by putting my dev skillset to use:

* contact Ethan Brown of Beyond Meat to see if there's anything he could do with my volunteer hours

* Investigate whether there is an issue with finding locations for windfarms and if that is a real limiting factor in having more. Seems like a simple enough problem to solve

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#84

Post by qbaqbaqba »

anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

Perhaps you can write more efficient code? Use HTML instead of JS when you can? Don't force people to buy a new phone/computer every x years?

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#85

Post by anotherturn »

andrei_says_ wrote: post #58
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

Elect people who are willing to take science-supported reality in consideration when creating policy.

Votes only count if the people you vote for can be counted on. Those people are often very thin on the ground, hard to identify (it could be a political masquerade) or are unelectable because the voting majority don't like them.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#86

Post by anotherturn »

sjy wrote: post #64
anotherturn wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To make a dent I suspect becoming a vegetarian isn't enough - you'd have to become an effective-evangelical vegetarian. So, given that fear and shock tactics are failing - how do I convince the world (or a sizeable portion of it) to become vegetarian? I heard a podcast recently about a guy working to produce real meat from plant matter. This would probably be an effective solution. By spending time otherwise used for…

It is unrealistic to expect that any one person could convince a sizeable portion of the world to become vegetarian, but simply by being one you can influence others without being evangelical. I would not have become a vegetarian without the passive influence of friends who demonstrated that it was possible (and easy!), without actively encouraging me to switch. Being a vegetarian also reduces the amount of meat cons…

I was vegetarian for about 6 years but didn't have quite the same experience as you (in the early 2000's). By and large I was met with incredulity or confusion. Top Gear using the word "Vegetarian" as an insult didn't help matters either :p

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#87

Post by anotherturn »

anigbrowl wrote: post #39
anotherturn wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To make a dent I suspect becoming a vegetarian isn't enough - you'd have to become an effective-evangelical vegetarian. So, given that fear and shock tactics are failing - how do I convince the world (or a sizeable portion of it) to become vegetarian? I heard a podcast recently about a guy working to produce real meat from plant matter. This would probably be an effective solution. By spending time otherwise used for…

The best way to convince a large number of people is to write an emotionally powerful novel or screenplay. Fictional characters are by far the most powerful role models in society, so tell that story.

People are quick to forget though? I can't think of a film or book that brought some ethical misstep to the fore and changed human behavior en-mass over the long term?

Edit:

I guess religious texts could be used as a counterpoint.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#88

Post by qbaqbaqba »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #77
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

I see people mentioning things like "become a vegetarian" or "bike to work", but those are easy and neglible-impact things. Sure, they'd have a huge effect if half of the population suddenly adopted them, but that's not going to happen - so just going vegetarian yourself and calling it a day is not really helping anything. What I'd love to see is a list of high-impact work one could use their skills to help with. May…

I have some doubts about becoming vegetarian: soya cultivation has a huge negative impact on rain forests and on farmers. I prefer to obtain meat from local farmers that use traditional methods - don't abuse antibiotics and use locally grown pasture.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#89

Post by anotherturn »

7952 wrote: post #55
anotherturn wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you missed the point of the comment... "fear and shock tactics" have been applied to me wrt climate change, vegetarianism, etc. But all they seem to have done is desensitize me. Hence my saying that they do not work. I'm exploring whether there are things that I (and the rest of the HN audience) can do to make a dent. Right now my measure of effectiveness and productivity is almost exclusively related to dev…

Fear and shock dont work. Shame is the solution. Work to make bad actions socially unacceptable.

Kind of like the star rating system from Black Mirror?

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#90

Post by [deleted] »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #77
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

I see people mentioning things like "become a vegetarian" or "bike to work", but those are easy and neglible-impact things. Sure, they'd have a huge effect if half of the population suddenly adopted them, but that's not going to happen - so just going vegetarian yourself and calling it a day is not really helping anything. What I'd love to see is a list of high-impact work one could use their skills to help with. May…

[deleted]
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