Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

newhumanist.org.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 183 posts

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#71

Post by shradha408 »

weq wrote: post #47
greglindahl wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Become a vegetarian. Not only will you not contribute to the fish market, but you'll also reduce the amount of fertilizer flowing into the ocean.

Soy beans / palm oil are one of the top causes of deforestration in rainforests around the world. Being vego doesnt mean good for the planet, although yes, probably the main cause of desforestation is beef production... The permafrost is melting. coral reefs around the world are dieing. Its only a matter of years until fish populations to collapse (coral reefs house 75% of the world fish). Unfortunately the writing i…

Interesting! May I know the name of this documentary?

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#72

Post by gideonparanoid »

im3w1l wrote: post #15
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

We are living the Malthusian dystopia and the solution is as trivial to state as it is impossible to implement. A global one child policy.

> A global one child policy.

This would essentially wipe out siblings, which could mean that we lose any associated culture?

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#73

Post by anotherturn »

NumberCruncher wrote: post #44
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

>>how would you fix the oceans Use your bike whenever it is possible instead of your car. By the way it is also good for your health not only for the environment. Buy products that are produced in your neighbourhood and are not shipped twice around the world.

I don't have a car so tend to take public transport or walk. But that aside, I recall reading that heavy industry releases a great deal more CO2 than all cars on the roads and that cars are a bit of a red-herring. No source though so I could be wrong.

Shipping, yes. That is a great polluter - good shout - though it primarily applies to food right? It's tricky to buy everything locally-produced e.g the mac I'm typing on. Shipping exists in part because raw materials are spread throughout the globe.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#74

Post by projectorlochsa »

anticodon wrote: post #60
anotherturn wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To make a dent I suspect becoming a vegetarian isn't enough - you'd have to become an effective-evangelical vegetarian. So, given that fear and shock tactics are failing - how do I convince the world (or a sizeable portion of it) to become vegetarian? I heard a podcast recently about a guy working to produce real meat from plant matter. This would probably be an effective solution. By spending time otherwise used for…

I'm a vegetarian myself, although for another reason: I don't want living beings to be tortured and killed for my food. But I find is that vegetarian propaganda is many times so disgusting and based on lies that it's probably going to turn people away from vegeterian food. Some vegeterians and vegans are obnoxious bigots and their efforts are generating opposite result - people start hating vegeterians and vegeterian…

Although, male calves are killed in milk production. Dairy cows cannot produce thousands of liters of milk without living a short life. Chickens that produce eggs were bred into monsters that can't live long.

I do not think any hate is rational and believe that any kind of vegan propaganda is beneficial to the cause.

Fossil fuels are nothing compared to nitrite waste.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#75

Post by anotherturn »

MrQuincle wrote: post #59
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

Technically. + Instead of hunting on the seas we should perform aquaculture. Establish diets that can use sea vegetables. Create methods to harvest on sea. This can reduce CO2 in the oceans and reduces the burden on land. + Accelerating research into reducing the CO2 footprint of our food. Lab grown meat and fish needs to be on wafer scales. + Create market places that reduces friction between CO2 producers and CO2 r…

All great suggestions. Something that seems like it could be a side project would be to "Make it easier to find locations for wind mills." I suspect at present the primary limiting factors are locating areas of land that are

(1) windy (2) accessible (3) cheap to develop?

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#76

Post by qplex »

SwellJoe wrote: post #36
sporkenfang wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oddly, I think outright banning fossil fuel refinement and usage would do more. Being an only child seems to be a bit psychologically damaging. I could conjecture for pages here, but suffice it to say I believe one is better off having 2-3 children or none at all. Sure there can be situations like being raised closely with cousins or friends that are similarly beneficial, but kids absolutely must have close companion…

I agree with your first assertion, but would need to see some science on the second. I don't recall ever reading about negative outcomes for only children. On the contrary only children often have many advantages. More parental attention and time. More resources, all other things being equal. More money for college. More money for medical care (braces, eye care, etc.). More money and time for hobbies like sports or m…

If you have siblings, one of the most important lessons you can learn is that it's not all about you.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#77

Post by TeMPOraL »

anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

I see people mentioning things like "become a vegetarian" or "bike to work", but those are easy and neglible-impact things. Sure, they'd have a huge effect if half of the population suddenly adopted them, but that's not going to happen - so just going vegetarian yourself and calling it a day is not really helping anything.

What I'd love to see is a list of high-impact work one could use their skills to help with. Maybe some research groups would use a better software package? Maybe there's a process that could help and is not yet economically viable, but could be made such?

Let's try and list things like that.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#78

Post by CalRobert »

gideonparanoid wrote: post #72
im3w1l wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are living the Malthusian dystopia and the solution is as trivial to state as it is impossible to implement. A global one child policy.

> A global one child policy. This would essentially wipe out siblings, which could mean that we lose any associated culture?

The concern is that the alternative could wipe out humans, which of course includes siblings.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#79

Post by _andromeda_ »

andrei_says_ wrote: post #58
anotherturn wrote: post #10

It's not really enough to read and upvote, but I'm at a loss as to what I can personally can do about this. So in the spirit of the askhn "how would you turn around Twitter" - let's apply the same thinking to this: "how would you fix the oceans "? There must be some practical steps that one or many of the hn audience can execute?

Elect people who are willing to take science-supported reality in consideration when creating policy.

I've come to firmly reject this idea lately. I have been asking myself this question of the validity of climate change science. I came to this conclusion: all the policy in the world wouldn't matter unless one thing happened - find more cost effective energy alternatives. Period. End of story.

Now, whether you're a climate change denier or not, all this boils down to is, is it(energy source) cheaper? Not just cheaper in terms of a one to one comparison but also included is the cost of deployment. You've got to embrace a praxeological vantage point and ask, what will the majority of actors purposefully engage in in order to meet their energy demands? Will most humans choose clean energy because it is good for the environment even though it hurts them fiscally? The hurtful but pragmatic answer to this is a firm NO.

Think about how hard government policy has tried to deal with something that's already illegal - drugs - and yet it has failed spectacularly. Will these same government actors all of a sudden become competent enough to deal with big oil (whom I believe are just being pragmatic about meeting the world energy demands)?

Once you put it that way, it becomes very clear, policy is borderline nonsense and is just another excuse for government to infringe on private property rights.

So, the solution? Intense research in finding energy alternatives that are truly cheaper in terms of BOTH large scale deployment as well as one to one comparison. Right now I'm not convinced we have anything that fits the bill.

Re: What fossil fuels are doing to our oceans

#80

Post by btschaegg »

anticodon wrote: post #60
anotherturn wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To make a dent I suspect becoming a vegetarian isn't enough - you'd have to become an effective-evangelical vegetarian. So, given that fear and shock tactics are failing - how do I convince the world (or a sizeable portion of it) to become vegetarian? I heard a podcast recently about a guy working to produce real meat from plant matter. This would probably be an effective solution. By spending time otherwise used for…

I'm a vegetarian myself, although for another reason: I don't want living beings to be tortured and killed for my food. But I find is that vegetarian propaganda is many times so disgusting and based on lies that it's probably going to turn people away from vegeterian food. Some vegeterians and vegans are obnoxious bigots and their efforts are generating opposite result - people start hating vegeterians and vegeterian…

Dito for me (although I personally take the climate influences more as a reason than the ethics). The interesting thing is that, if someone finds out by chance that I'm a vegetarian, they always ask me for the reason. At times I almost suspect they expect some moral lecture just to be able to oppose it.

Something in human nature just seems to force us to dig trenches that way.

Also, there are the moments when you as the vegetarian get lectured on how "it's natural" to eat meat when in my area, some 50-60 years ago, you would have been inredibly rich or lucky if you got one piece of meat each day. Go figure.

Post reply on HN