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Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

nytimes.com

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Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#201

Post by lightcatcher »

IanCal wrote: post #181
lightcatcher wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So if you were running Uber, would you increase your prices to pay a more fair wage even if it makes you more expensive than competitors? Would you expect to stay in business if you offered a commodity like transport at 20% higher prices than competitors?

Is it a particularly ethical standpoint to say "I don't pay my driver's a fair wage, but if I did then I wouldn't make money!"? I would rather have companies be forced to pay a reasonable minimum wage and compete by improving the service or efficiency, not just pushing the employees to work for less and less.

> Is it a particularly ethical standpoint to say "I don't pay my driver's a fair wage, but if I did then I wouldn't make money!"?

Not very ethical, but rational, profitable, and prevalent. Cost is a large area to compete in, and people are expensive.

It would be nice if companies acted ethically, but that isn't their reason for existence (especially in fast growing or large companies). If it's not surprising to me when companies act unethically, can I honestly say that I expect them to act ethically? Not if expect means "assign high probability to".

I agree that regulation is needed. It seems that often basic economics (people want to move around as cheaply as possible) lead to unethical situations (paying people as little as possible to move people around). I'm far from an expert of economics, but it seems like regulation is a way to change the rules of the game to have more ethical/fair/uniformly distributed equilibriums at some cost in net efficiency.

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#202

Post by superioritycplx »

wavefunction wrote: post #136
paulddraper wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Muslims from Algeria (99% of the population) can enter. Christians from Syria cannot. That's the weirdest Muslim ban I've ever heard of.

It's almost as if it were a muslim ban as applied by ignorant people... As if!

It's a temporary ban of seven countries that was drafted by the Obama administration.

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#203

Post by jsemrau »

trustfundbaby wrote: post #164
deusex_ wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Europe, your bus fare would be half of the price and probably you would need one or two connections. The public transport is much more developed and to me seems like a much better mass transportation alternative. More ecological, cheaper, less cars overall.

It also helps that Europe and its cities are ... smaller.

European cities are not smaller in terms of population or services offered. It's just European cities are better planned compared to most American cities. This whole "suburban" lifestyle .....

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#204

Post by mahyarm »

orange_county wrote: post #188
digitalzombie wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> can you or someone else explain how the driver makes less when taking on more passengers? Summer Lyft driver here. As a passenger you get the option to choose to get a ride alone, just you and the lyft driver, to your destination like a taxi. This is the default option and it's the most expensive one. The new option that Uber have and Lyft is doing is pooled rides. Instead of having the Lyft car to yourself, you're…

But that doesn't explain how the driver gets less money when they pick up more pool riders? The rates goes down when they pick up the 2nd and 3rd rider, but then at the same time they are gaining more fares. So shouldn't that make up for the rate drop? It's pretty obvious why doing pool for one rider is a huge loss, but I'm not quite sure how it is more of a loss if a 2nd or 3rd rider joins in.

Uber & lyft is really bad at showing how it works because the system is over complicated. The way it looks is they are getting ripped off all of the time and so they don't like it.

http://therideshareguy.com/how-does-uberpool-pricing-work/

Basically they are paid the same way as an UberX ride, by mile and by time, at a lower rate (0.75/mile vs 0.85/mile). But they are also paid for going out of their way to pick up new people in between, which in uberX they are not compensated for. Some math nerd in the company probably calculated it as equivalent using their historical data, said eureka, and made the business case for uberpool.

But that is way too complicated to understand, so natrually people feel like they are ripped off. If they just made it same uberX rate and just told drivers you get paid for distance and time and do not show them anything else, I don't think they will care. To them it's would be another uberX

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#205

Post by TheArcane »

deusex_ wrote: post #160
foxfired wrote: post #127

Here is how I see it. I rely on those rides to go to work every single day and here what it (would) costs me. Uber: $250 a month.(Majority) Lyft: $500 a month (Whenever Uber is too expensive) Bus : $100 a month (1h:15 for 6 miles and 3 buses... No) Politics and all internal conflicts aside, there is a need for these services whether we like it or not. When I need to make a decision in the morning I take whatever is t…

In Europe, your bus fare would be half of the price and probably you would need one or two connections. The public transport is much more developed and to me seems like a much better mass transportation alternative. More ecological, cheaper, less cars overall.

€30 in my city for unlimited bus travel for a month.

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#207

Post by IanCal »

Arnt wrote: post #187
IanCal wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always dislike these comparisons. The truth is simply that it depends. You can't justify an unknown city having a certain quality of bus routes compared to a diverse range of tens of countries by saying "it's smaller". It'd be slower and more expensive in some parts of the UK, easier in others and in some countries I assume you'd be expected to just cycle the 6 miles.

Which ones would that be? 6 miles is 10 km, that's a nice ride but I've never heard of traffic planners that expect 10km rides.

Maybe I'm totally wrong on this, I guess it just didn't seem like an odd choice in the UK and other countries have much stronger focus on cycling. "People I know" will be a hugely unrepresentative sample though.

For another unrepresentative sample, cycling commuters on strava average a bit over 10 miles: http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest-news/10-stats-pai...

I can't find the stat I want for Copenhagen, they have 1/3rd to 1/2 of people commuting by bike but I can't find out how many journeys of ~10km are completed by bike. I know it's a small number of cycle journeys, as many are shorter, but that's not quite what I'm after.

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#208

Post by mahyarm »

freyr wrote: post #72
smileysteve wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The key points are - CEO never blackmailed journalists - No major revelations of sexual harassment - ~~No major revelations of political support~~ Related to core business - Surge Limit has prevented complaints about emergency pricing vs Uber. - Lyft takes a lower commission capped at 20%/25% - Lyft has in app digital tipping (drivers keep 100% of tips). Uber's tip policy encourages cash, which is an often cited comp…

> Lyft has in app digital tipping (drivers keep 100% of tips). One of the reasons I don't like Lyft. How about this system: pay the drivers a fair wage up front, so they don't need to subsist on the generosity of strangers. If they get great ratings, you can give them a bonus.

One driver told me that lyft kept a portion of tips until you've covered a portion of some incentive. Thats the annoying thing about digital tips and most of this crap, there is no real transparency on who gets what. If you really want to make sure a driver keeps a tip, just give it to them directly in cash.

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#209

Post by IanCal »

lightcatcher wrote: post #201
IanCal wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it a particularly ethical standpoint to say "I don't pay my driver's a fair wage, but if I did then I wouldn't make money!"? I would rather have companies be forced to pay a reasonable minimum wage and compete by improving the service or efficiency, not just pushing the employees to work for less and less.

> Is it a particularly ethical standpoint to say "I don't pay my driver's a fair wage, but if I did then I wouldn't make money!"? Not very ethical, but rational, profitable, and prevalent. Cost is a large area to compete in, and people are expensive. It would be nice if companies acted ethically, but that isn't their reason for existence (especially in fast growing or large companies). If it's not surprising to me wh…

I think this comes back to the original statement of "It's always reasonable to expect companies to pay their people a fair wage."

This is a bit ambiguous, and perhaps it's a different reading of it that's the contention.

Expect can either mean I think it's likely, as in I expect the sun to rise tomorrow, or a requirement.

I am not surprised that uber try and pay their drivers so little, but I am disappointed and want better from them.

> I'm far from an expert of economics, but it seems like regulation is a way to change the rules of the game to have more ethical/fair/uniformly distributed equilibriums at some cost in net efficiency.

I agree. Safety regulations are a good example of this.

Re: Lyft Is Said to Seek New Funding as Its Rival Uber Stumbles

#210

Post by mahyarm »

envy2 wrote: post #10
techsupporter wrote: post #3

Forgive me if this is me being dense, but from an outsider's perspective I don't understand what makes Lyft any better than Uber. Neither company properly categorizes their drivers (as employees), both have a rather sizeable cut from fares, both depended on being basically illegal cabs--except for Uber Black, which uses licensed black car services--to get started, and neither has a financially viable business model.…

It's not—and anyone who says that it is is deluding themselves. I think we've reached the point where ridesharing apps are 100% a commodity: there's no real product differentiation, so I'll choose based on price and how long it'll take the car to arrive. Lyft drivers seem 'happier,' but that hasn't translated into anything significantly different for me in terms of ride quality. This won't be a popular opinion, but I…

TBH, driving is a harder skill to learn than being a McDonalds fry cook.
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