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SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

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Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#271

Post by XorNot »

hackuser wrote: post #113

Note that NASA, I believe at Trump's urging, recently said they would try to place humans on the first flight of the Space Launch System (the new heavy lift rocket) - i.e., no unmanned testing first. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/15/science/nasa-looks-to-spe... Is Musk still maintaining a relationship with Trump? When Uber founder Travis Kalanick left Trump's business council, Musk was still on it AFAIK. I wonder i…

I'm pretty sure Musk is doing what's reliably necessary to keep his companies running under Trump.

An administration full of oil wealth and climate change deniers are a significant business risk when you make electric cars and have States banking photovoltaics.

He needs to be within Trump's monkeysphere.

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#272

Post by maxerickson »

lettergram wrote: post #187
hackuser wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The next person to take a picture of the Earth from moon may not be on a government funded mission. Note that the press release says: Most importantly, we would like to thank NASA, without whom this would not be possible. NASA’s Commercial Crew Program, which provided most of the funding for Dragon 2 development, is a key enabler for this mission. Your tax dollars, if you are American, helped pay for this. Thank yo…

Rockets (or any research) > bombs any day of the week. Yes, my tax dollars going towards research (even indirectly) is better than the way most of my money is spent

Historically rocket research has been funded to develop the capability to deliver bombs.

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#273

Post by TeMPOraL »

mulmen wrote: post #249
chris_va wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, the Falcon Heavy has similar fuel capacity to a 747. (plus or minus)

That is a really surprising comparison, thanks for pointing it out! Do you have a source for that, it is something I expect to be repeating.

I agree. For some reason I imagined that orbital-capable rockets use order(s) of magnitude more fuel than airliners...

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#274

Post by [deleted] »

kobeya wrote: post #143
CommieBobDole wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not for the Falcon 9/Falcon Heavy that will be used in this launch; it uses RP-1 (basically very pure jet fuel, AKA kerosene) and liquid oxygen as fuel. The Shuttle and the new Space Launch System will use hydrogen/LOX, which exhausts basically water vapor.

Well, not the SRB part.

[deleted]

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#275

Post by yellowapple »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #270
XorNot wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SpaceX for a landing mission wouldn't try and build a larger rocket, they'd definitely argue to just do multiple launches instead. Fuel tankering is within their area of interest for Mars.

I believe this (mating tanks given multiple missions) is what they were considering. Imagine you have your reusable falcon 9 boost into orbit a 'fuel only' second stage. Land the first stage, put another one on it, and send it up again. Once you have your 'boost pack' up in orbit, presumably docking with each other into a single unit, you launch your crew which attaches to the 'tug' that takes them to the moon. ULA h…

This can be applied to much more than just fuel, mind you. Interplanetary manned vehicles might very well end up looking like space stations, with a bunch of modules docked together in order to provide the necessary creature comforts to sustain a crew for months on end.

In fact, a permanently-in-orbit transfer vehicle might make sense here; have this vehicle run the actual EarthMars transfers, then just shuttle in fuel/supplies/crew on each Earth arrival.

Either way, a Falcon-like reusable launch system makes plenty of sense here in terms of making this sort of thing possible.

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#276

Post by nsajko »

runesoerensen wrote: post #5

> We are excited to announce that SpaceX has been approached to fly two private citizens on a trip around the moon late next year. They have already paid a significant deposit to do a moon mission. Can't wait to hear who booked this trip! Definitely one of the coolest ways to spend a lot of superfluous money :)

It would be cooler if they donated it for sending more robots to Mars...

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#277

Post by clock_tower »

Mithaldu wrote: post #229
clock_tower wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Lexus would do much of the same; Toyota's already got plug-in hybrids, and is working on hydrogen fuel cells. (As for the other expenditures proposed above: real AOC Champagne supports the vineyards and traditional practices of the Champagne province of France; caviar... supports sturgeon fishermen? But consuming both together is just conspicuous consumption -- Champagne is a dessert wine. :) )

Thanks for the correction. Buy Toyotas then, folks, if you can't afford Teslas. :D

Already there. :)

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#278

Post by clock_tower »

wmf wrote: post #230
clock_tower wrote: post #210

Which would be more expensive: a personal SpaceX flight to the Moon, or personally funding a high-speed rail line from Seattle to Vancouver?

Definitely rail, which is something like a zillion dollars per mile. The moon trip is only $40-160M.

$40-$160M? I didn't realize just how far the price had fallen for a literal moonshot... Thanks!

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#279

Post by CydeWeys »

jessriedel wrote: post #253
dperfect wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China has been working up to getting a space capability to send people to the Moon with the full backing of the government funding, by 2035[1]. They started in 2003. SpaceX was founded in 2002 and they are saying they will fly someone around the moon next year? I don't want to downplay SpaceX at all because I'm a huge fan, but isn't flying someone to the moon (and presumably back) more complicated than just flying…

Right. SpaceX doesn't have a craft capable of lunar orbit rendezvous https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_orbit_rendezvous so they would need to return to the Earth directly from the surface of the moon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_ascent Direct ascent requires a much larger initial launch mass, i.e., a larger rocket than has ever been built. Since it took the massive Saturn V to complete the Apollo missions u…

> Right. SpaceX doesn't have a craft capable of lunar orbit rendezvous

Why not? Their Dragon capsules can dock with the ISS; why wouldn't they be able to dock with each, possibly with some kind of adapter? You can imagine one Dragon and a trunk docking with another upper stage that's all fuel tank, heading to the Moon, undocking in orbit, landing, ascending, and rendezvousing in orbit to return home.

The total dv requirements of landing on the Moon and ascending again starting from low Moon orbit is 4 km/s. I haven't done the math, but I suspect that you can put together a workable mission using two Falcon Heavy launches. Now, granted, they don't have all the exact pieces put together quite yet, but I suspect they've been thinking about it.

Re: SpaceX to Send Privately Crewed Dragon Spacecraft Beyond the Moon Next Year

#280

Post by paulddraper »

wallace_f wrote: post #263
paulddraper wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I also think that spending money on a roundtrip to the moon is way better for humanity than spending it on champagne, caviar and cars. How? I'm not saying you're wrong, but gut instinct is that automobiles are more useful to humans. I'd like to hear your thought process.

I believe the technology that will benefit humanity significantly is in the batteries.

That's why we need battery-powered rockets.

http://bart.volgers.eu/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Dilbert-El...

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