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Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

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Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#31

Post by threeseed »

koonsolo wrote: post #12
trendia wrote: post #11

The way this is worded is weird: Claim: "In Sweden there are a number of 'no-go zones' where criminality and gangs have taken over and where the emergency services do not dare to go." Facts: No. In a report published in February 2016, the Swedish Police Authority identified 53 residential areas around the country that have become increasingly marred by crime, social unrest and insecurity. These places have been incor…

Same as in Belgium then. They even throw stones at fire-fighters when they are doing their job. So nothing to worry about, right? And I don't know if it is the same in Sweden, but you are not really politically allowed to say what kind of people live in those neighborhoods. So again, nothing to worry about.

You can say whatever you want. What's important and this release is trying to demonstrate is that if you're going to make claims then provide the evidence.

Sure you could blame Muslims for those no-go areas. But you need to demonstrate it. And demonstrate absent other factors like socioeconomic status, unemployment rate etc.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#32

Post by reacweb »

rmc wrote: post #28
koonsolo wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same as in Belgium then. They even throw stones at fire-fighters when they are doing their job. So nothing to worry about, right? And I don't know if it is the same in Sweden, but you are not really politically allowed to say what kind of people live in those neighborhoods. So again, nothing to worry about.

> Same as in Belgium then. They even throw stones at fire-fighters when they are doing their job. So nothing to worry about, right? Who reports that people do that? Tabloid newspapers? They've been lying about that for decades. After the 1989 Hillsbourogh disaster (where people died due to health & safety issues, and negligence from the police), tabloid newspaper The Sun wrote a full page headline accusing Liverpool…

you mean that the cost issues of bulletproof vest for firefighter were also fabrication ?

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#33

Post by dagenleg »

mseebach wrote: post #22
dagenleg wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. RT is very biased, but is fairly factual once you learn to ignore the bias. They do a lot of pretty impressive journalistic work, like frontline reporting. If you exclude it completely, you miss a big part of the picture.

Different media for different purposes. There are many of these highly biased "marginal" media outlets that often contain tidbits of facts that aren't reported elsewhere, and yes, sometimes it's because those facts don't match the (oppositely biased) narrative (and sometimes it's because those facts are indeed not relevant for reporting), and that's useful for surfacing these facts so you can make up your own mind. B…

You are assuming that there's a way for an uninformed reader to get his hands on 'unbiased' media. If you don't sift through the biases yourself the "high-level acquaintance" you acquire will be inevitably biased, since someone had to do it for you.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#34

Post by Sacho »

otalp wrote: post #23

According to the official statistics on The Swedish Crime Survey, the sexual violence rate in Sweden remained about the same between 2005 and 2014. The refugee crisis began around 2014, and since then, the rates for sexual violence went down in 2015[1] something you never see mentioned on certain parts of the internet. 2016 saw an increase in crimes, but still less than pre-immigration levels in 2014. Also the Swedis…

Thank you for the actual statistics; can you provide a source for the legislative change? I found sources for 2005 and 2008 changes, but not one for 2013.

There's also one particular thing that doesn't pass the smell test for me from your German article:

"Less than 1 percent of the total crimes committed by refugees are sex crimes, going against rumours spread on social media that these have become more common with the arrival of hundreds of thousands of refugees."

1% doesn't strike me as a very low percentage of sex crimes, but I googled around for some statistics, and found another article from the same source - https://www.thelocal.de/20160218/refugees-to-germany-commit-...

Here, the title is that "refugees commit less crime than Germans". However, the stats they quote show otherwise - despite refugees being anywhere from 0.8 to 2%, they committed at least 4% of the sex crimes in the country - a factor of at least 2. The article itself says that the sexual assaults reported during the New Year's Eve were not part of this number, so this is a conservative estimate. The article quotes a ratio of 2:1 men over women as a mitigating factor, however, doing the math most favorably towards refugees(100% of sexual assaults committed by men, 40/60 split in men/women in Germany) leaves you with an adjusted rate of ~2.6% of crimes, still significantly higher than their proportionate population.

From that article though I was able to acquire this statistic for 2015:

"The total number of this type of crime committed nationwide throughout 2015 was almost 47,000"

From here - https://www.osac.gov/pages/ContentReportDetails.aspx?cid=170... - I found that the total criminal offenses in germany were close to ~6mil. From this you can calculate the rate of sexual assault for the german population - 47k / 6mil ~ 0.8%. It's not as significantly different from the previous number, but still doesn't support the claim that, at 1%, refugees commit less sexual crimes than the german population.

EDIT: There is also a mitigating factor I just thought of that the newspaper didn't mention; refugees are likely to have a poor economic status in Germany, and are thus more likely to commit crimes for that factor alone. I don't know how to calculate for that as well.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#35

Post by fpig »

dagenleg wrote: post #13
tormeh wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Breitbart, RT etc. are obviously not valid sources.

I disagree. RT is very biased, but is fairly factual once you learn to ignore the bias. They do a lot of pretty impressive journalistic work, like frontline reporting. If you exclude it completely, you miss a big part of the picture.

RT factual? You must have not been following their Ukraine coverage. They're likely the biggest liars of all mainstream media. They were somewhat OK until the Ukraine crisis started, that's when they started going full-retard.

RT published an article about the Ukrainian army shooting down that Malaysian passenger plane. I am not sure if it still exists, but I have read it on their web site. Then they quickly started changing their story in followup articles, but never actually published the truth about it (unless they published it since I stopped reading them, but I seriously doubt it).

The RT mentality seems to be "the truth doesn't matter, perception is everything". It is hard to find even a hint of journalistic integrity in their work. This is far beyond being "biased". Yeah, pretty much everyone is biased, but not in the despicable way RT is.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#36

Post by threeseed »

arethuza wrote: post #30
ArmandGrillet wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a few no-go zones in France, e.g. in the Northern districts of Marseille, where the police does not go except for big operations as it is too dangerous. It looks like it is not the case in Sweden as the police can still go everywhere, even if some districts are more dangerous than others.

I remember hearing something similar from a policeman here in Scotland ~30 years ago - to arrest someone who they expected to be violent from a high-rise in a rougher area would need a remarkable number of people involved as they didn't want to let anyone be out of sight of anyone else so that meant someone standing on each landing on the stairs. And that's nothing to do with immigrants just us Scots and our unfortun…

There are areas like this in most countries. And it's most often linked to poverty, youth unemployment, the stability of the family home and absence of good role models.

But instead people like to blame immigrants because it's easier. It's always that faceless person over there who is responsible for your problems.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#37

Post by andrewclunn »

Nobody is interested in generalized studies about immigration or 25 year statistical trends. They want to know what's happened in the last two years or so since the refugee crisis started. So much of what is put forward here just doesn't apply, and blatantly so, that I assume motivated reasoning.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#38

Post by denzil_correa »

koonsolo wrote: post #12
trendia wrote: post #11

The way this is worded is weird: Claim: "In Sweden there are a number of 'no-go zones' where criminality and gangs have taken over and where the emergency services do not dare to go." Facts: No. In a report published in February 2016, the Swedish Police Authority identified 53 residential areas around the country that have become increasingly marred by crime, social unrest and insecurity. These places have been incor…

Same as in Belgium then. They even throw stones at fire-fighters when they are doing their job. So nothing to worry about, right? And I don't know if it is the same in Sweden, but you are not really politically allowed to say what kind of people live in those neighborhoods. So again, nothing to worry about.

> So nothing to worry about, right

Who said there is nothing to worry?

> but you are not really politically allowed to say what kind of people live in those neighborhoods.

First, source for not allowed to say. Second, what do you want to say?

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#39

Post by akerro »

trendia wrote: post #11

The way this is worded is weird: Claim: "In Sweden there are a number of 'no-go zones' where criminality and gangs have taken over and where the emergency services do not dare to go." Facts: No. In a report published in February 2016, the Swedish Police Authority identified 53 residential areas around the country that have become increasingly marred by crime, social unrest and insecurity. These places have been incor…

VICE made a pretty good material about no-go zones in Sweden and anti-racist groups that demolish your car, house, get you fired from job for liking wrong thing on Facebook.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#40

Post by piva00 »

koonsolo wrote: post #12
trendia wrote: post #11

The way this is worded is weird: Claim: "In Sweden there are a number of 'no-go zones' where criminality and gangs have taken over and where the emergency services do not dare to go." Facts: No. In a report published in February 2016, the Swedish Police Authority identified 53 residential areas around the country that have become increasingly marred by crime, social unrest and insecurity. These places have been incor…

Same as in Belgium then. They even throw stones at fire-fighters when they are doing their job. So nothing to worry about, right? And I don't know if it is the same in Sweden, but you are not really politically allowed to say what kind of people live in those neighborhoods. So again, nothing to worry about.

No, not like that at the fucking all. I live in Stockholm, I just came today to my home from a friend's place that is in one of these pesky little maps marking it as a "no-go zone". Seriously, there's nothing alarming there at all, it's a very normal area a little bit outside the center with more affordable housing (compared to the center of Stockholm but not even near "cheap") and that's about it.

I've stayed on that friend's house for the whole of January, daily living there and haven't heard about a single crime happening. Asked my friend's flatmates just now and they laughed about it.

Same thing for a friend that lives inside what some maps label as "no-go zone" in Kista, nothing happened there at all for the past year.

So seriously, the alarmism here is very extrapolated compared to the actual risk. Compare to Belgium as you want but be a bit more honest about your utter ignorance instead of just a "And I don't know about Sweden"-trumpesque discourse.

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