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Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

militarytimes.com

211–220 of 322 posts

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#211
post #5

If you still think of the world as divided into good and evil, then I have to break it to you that you have been played. Brainwashed by years and years of media programming. One man's terrorist is another man's hero. The U.S routinely bombs other sovereign countries and this is show cased as a "hero" activity. If the bombed people retaliate, they are terrorists. The truth is not black/white. Same way U.S data surveil…

> The U.S routinely bombs other sovereign countries and this is show cased as a "hero" activity There's a lot of nuance here, because there isn't really a (current) clear-cut case of the US bombing a sovereign nation where the government has not given the US permission. Of the current active campaigns: - Afghanistan - Iraq - Pakistan Each of these countries has a functioning government, even mostly democratically ele…

- Afghanistan

- Iraq

- Pakistan

How is this different from when the USSR bombed Afghanistan with the permission of Afghani government which the Soviets installed?

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#213
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you still think of the world as divided into good and evil, then I have to break it to you that you have been played. People don't know the half of it, and in my experience, they don't want to know. It's comforting to feel like the good guys. The media is complicit, in that it intentionally leaves out relevant facts that might make us look bad. For example, take Iran. In 1953, we overthrew their democratically-e…

http://www.nytimes.com/1988/07/04/world/downing-flight-655-u... http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/inatl/longterm/flight80... The "Page A01" on the WaPo article is the front page. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuWOCLEuXu4 Which is not to say that such events are prominent in the memory of Americans, but it's just not true that they don't get put on the news. 2 of the biggest papers in the country (and I'm sure ma…

You are correct, they are reported, I was overly hyperbolic to say "nary a peep". They are just drastically underreported compared to attacks no the US and its allies.

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#214
post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Or you've probably never heard of Iran Flight 655, where in 1988 a reckless US cruiser drifted into Iranian waters and shot down an Iranian commercial airplane in Iranian airspace. 290 fatalities, including women and children. 8th deadliest disaster in aviation history, nary a peep in the US media: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655 . But they are the reckless terrorists to watch out for. ' Nary a pee…

Compare it to the Soviets shooting down Korean Air Lines Flight 007 in 1983. Chomsky writes, "For the month of September 1983 alone, the New York Times index—the very densely printed index of articles that have appeared in the Times —has seven full pages devoted to this story. That's the index , for one month alone. The liberal Boston Globe on the first day of coverage had its first ten full pages devoted to that sto…

The phrase "nary a peep" means "never one single small sound". The context of this discussion is about entirely unreported drone strikes, not the number of pages devoted to a front page incident.

Your points are fair, but there's no need to start an argument over misreading what the parent comment what trying to say.

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#215
post #199
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you still think of the world as divided into good and evil, then I have to break it to you that you have been played. People don't know the half of it, and in my experience, they don't want to know. It's comforting to feel like the good guys. The media is complicit, in that it intentionally leaves out relevant facts that might make us look bad. For example, take Iran. In 1953, we overthrew their democratically-e…

>Or you've probably never heard of Iran Flight 655, where in 1988 a reckless US cruiser drifted into Iranian waters and shot down an Iranian commercial airplane in Iranian airspace. 290 fatalities, including women and children. 8th deadliest disaster in aviation history, nary a peep in the US media: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655 . But they are the reckless terrorists to watch out for. ' Nary a pee…

I was a teenager at the time and I remember watching it on the news on broadcast TV.

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#216

President Trump wasn't wrong when he said terror attacks are under reported but sadly the underreported ones are committed by the United States and her allies. What exactly is the "big picture" I'm missing here that is achieved by levelling Yemen one mud brick building at a time?

And he wasn't wrong when he said in that recent super bowl interview "we aren't so innocent". Everyone is still jumping on him like he was saying the US is just the same as Russia, unable to accept the nuance that America has a lot of crimes to answer for.

As much as I hate to say it, Trump was right on this one. For every Russian journalist killed by the Kremlin, you could match them with an American anti-Vietnam activist, black activist, and yes, even journalists (Reuters).

Still doesn't make it Ok.

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#217
post #24
post #11

i'm disappointed that hardly any members of the media or Democratic party establishment talk about Obama's expansion of the drone program. we have a long list of names. the executive branch of our government curates the list unilaterally and in secret. then, we cross names off the list by killing them. sometimes, they're American citizens. often, they're in countries we're at peace or even allied with. there are chil…

> there are children in Yemen right now who are afraid of blue skies. On that point, I would encourage everyone to read this article and watch the accompanying video: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/feb/10/drones-dream-y... The Yemeni boy featured, whose father and older brother were killed already in US drone strikes, is quoted as saying that children in his village have nightmares of the drones. The boy hims…

Killer robots trawling the skies and bringing nightmares to children. If that's not the purest depiction of terrorism, I don't know what is.

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#218
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The older I get the more interesting and sensible Chomsky gets. Until a few years ago I was perceiving him as boring and monotone and now I am seeing a fierce warrior of truth* holding language as his weapon. This 9 min. excerpt on propaganda terms in the Media is especially appropriate. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vmoXze-Higc *I don't mean some objective truth out there but a viewpoint which is rooted in his very…

I think that Chomsky has to have a very bland delivery, because the same message delivered with a more impassioned style would make him seem unhinged by the casual observer.

I remember him saying that his delivery style was very deliberately chosen by him, although he didn't say why.

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#219
post #5

If you still think of the world as divided into good and evil, then I have to break it to you that you have been played. Brainwashed by years and years of media programming. One man's terrorist is another man's hero. The U.S routinely bombs other sovereign countries and this is show cased as a "hero" activity. If the bombed people retaliate, they are terrorists. The truth is not black/white. Same way U.S data surveil…

YES! But this bears question, why is that so? Why is the US empire (and the US oligarchy) so thirsty for war that it is willing (one could even argue: eager) to sacrifice lives, physical and psychical health of its people (soldiers)? Why is it not putting trillions into infrastructure, health, education instead of spending them to wage wars with nations which have not even thought to attack the US, let alone have don…

"War is a racket"

https://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.html

Re: Thousands of deadly U.S. military airstrikes have gone unreported

#220
post #203
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you still think of the world as divided into good and evil, then I have to break it to you that you have been played. People don't know the half of it, and in my experience, they don't want to know. It's comforting to feel like the good guys. The media is complicit, in that it intentionally leaves out relevant facts that might make us look bad. For example, take Iran. In 1953, we overthrew their democratically-e…

> In 1953, we overthrew their democratically-elected government in favor of the opposition No, we didn't: the rightful government (the Shah's) overthrew an attempted dictator. Mossadegh lived out the rest of his life in peace, and died in bed. > Or you've probably never heard of Iran Flight 655, where in 1988 a reckless US cruiser drifted into Iranian waters and shot down an Iranian commercial airplane in Iranian air…

> No, we didn't: the rightful government (the Shah's) overthrew an attempted dictator. Mossadegh lived out the rest of his life in peace, and died in bed.

Only if you define "rightful" as the government that the UK and US decided was favorable to them, and not the one supported consistently by the Iranian people via elections. I don't see how you can argue this point — both the US and UK have outright admitted to their actions (fomenting and supporting the coup) and to their reasons for doing so (oil). And Mossadegh was sentenced to execution, but his life was personally spared by the Shah.

> No, it wasn't reckless: the electronic data gave Vincennes good reason to believe that it was being attacked by an Iranian fighter.

"Three years after the incident, Admiral William J. Crowe admitted on American television show Nightline that Vincennes was inside Iranian territorial waters when it launched the missiles." Is this not reckless?

"Commander David Carlson, commanding officer of USS Sides, the warship stationed nearest to Vincennes at the time of the incident, is reported to have said that the destruction of the aircraft 'marked the horrifying climax to Captain Rogers's aggressiveness, first seen four weeks ago'." Reckless according to his own colleague.

"Throughout its final flight, IR655 was in radio contact with various air traffic control services using standard civil aviation frequencies, and had spoken in English to Bandar Abbas Approach Control seconds before Vincennes launched its missiles. According to the U.S. Navy investigation Vincennes at that time had no equipment suitable for monitoring civil aviation frequencies, other than the International Air Distress frequency."

Obviously the Vincennes didn't commit a brazen attack for no reason at all. They had some reason to believe they might be attacked. But sailing into another country's waters and airspace with no ability to differentiate between fighter and commercial jet is reckless, and furthermore it was done by a captain with a history of reckless behavior.

> The 2 million South Vietnamese who fled their country after North Vietnam conquered sure seemed to have appreciated our defense: while we were there, they didn't take to the sea in boats, fleeing for their lives.

They were forced to fight a war they didn't support for decades, under a brutal and unpopular autocratic leader, Diem. He forced his pro-Christian and anti-Communist sentiments on his people and oppressed those who disagreed until he was eventually assassinated. Meanwhile the US devastated the country and drove the North into a fight-or-flight state of desperation. Of course the people of the South didn't want to stick around to face their vengeance.

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