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Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

nytimes.com

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Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#481

Post by robbiep »

croon wrote: post #477
robbiep wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mis-typed; it is clear that you have an anti trump bias from Your posting history. My previous comment should be interpreted as me feeling that you have reacted strongly against me under the assumption that I was pro trump, an assumption I have only weak evidence for. >how else are we meant to interpret that You are assuming malevolence in my theorised intentions and actions without having any basis for it. I think…

> You are assuming malevolence in my theorised intentions and actions without having any basis for it. The only basis I have to possibly assume things from is what you write. You made the comparison from someone disobeying an order based on a professional assessment that the order was unconstitutional - to an employee disobeying an order. The only comparison in that case that would be apt would be an employee that is…

inclination or prejudice for or against one person or group, especially in a way considered to be unfair. No, I do not have a bias. I judge anyone only on what they say and do.

Great, we would probably enjoy each other's company.

The only basis I have to possibly assume things from is what you write. You made the comparison from someone disobeying an order based on a professional assessment that the order was unconstitutional - to an employee disobeying an order.

Well I think we are interpreting the parent paragraph and my reply in totally different lights. As I point out elsewhere, I think there is a difference between a sackable offence through disloyalty, and not following an order because you don't agree with the validity of it, expert or not. I am not making any claim regarding the actual substance of the executive order; or whether trump's use of disloyal is 'correct' (I personally think it's a beatup) ; only that disloyalty is undermining and is a fireable offence..

>Dictators rely on loyalty, leaders listen to council, regardless of business or politics.

Mate, the whole fucking world revolves around loyalty; also known as friendship or cordial business relations to change spheres again. It holds democracies together just as much as dicktatorships. Doesn't make disloyalty any less of a fireable offence.

there's too much strong systemiser here on both sides. Anyway, not my country, and probably won't be one for much longer, which is going to have some pretty profound implications. Enjoy the fireworks and stay safe.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#482

Post by LordKano »

brewdad wrote: post #473
LordKano wrote: post #463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same polls that predicted Hillary's win? I'm not buying it.

Hilary did win. The popular vote. Which is really what most of the polls were tracking. 80,000 votes out of 130,000,000+ swung the EC. Aside from holding an actual election, no poll can get the margin of error down to that level. The polls were not wrong. They were polls.

History can't be retconned this quickly.

The polls were done state by state and showed Hillary with a substantial electoral college advantage over Trump.

These poll results weren't about reporting on the feelings of the electorate, they were about trying to influence them.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#483

Post by savagej »

sctb wrote: post #456
savagej wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you so stupid as to think America will not defend its borders? Why are you so stupid as to not realize America is modeled on individual freedom, which is incompatible with Sharia Jihadis? Defense of individual freedom and liberty (i.e. preventing the creation a police state and ensuring gun rights) is more important than leftist feelings. There are some bad dudes to remove in the meantime.

Please stop posting like this—personal attacks are not OK on Hacker News and we've already asked you to stop violating the guidelines. We have to ban accounts that won't post civilly and substantively.

I assume you gave the same warning to the parent of my post. I was making a point due to their language:

"When did America become so stupid to vote in these people?"

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#484

Post by savagej »

edblarney wrote: post #369
savagej wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you so stupid as to think America will not defend its borders? Why are you so stupid as to not realize America is modeled on individual freedom, which is incompatible with Sharia Jihadis? Defense of individual freedom and liberty (i.e. preventing the creation a police state and ensuring gun rights) is more important than leftist feelings. There are some bad dudes to remove in the meantime.

I don't like Trump, but I also think there is too much hysteria ... But don't be calling people stupid here (i.e. don't be a victim of all this hysteria).

Read the post I was replying to. I suppose the left gets to call names but the right does not.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#485

Post by bobwaycott »

cookiecaper wrote: post #478
bobwaycott wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're talking past my point to a different one. And no, as both a principle and rule, I do not expect everyone to lay out their case when refusing to go along with an order they believe to violate their oath and/or the Constitution. Acting AG Yates made it clear that she questioned the legality and justness of the order and would not be able to defend it. She also knew exactly what would happen next. You've been rep…

>You're talking past my point to a different one. And no, as both a principle and rule, I do not expect everyone to lay out their case when refusing to go along with an order they believe to violate their oath and/or the Constitution. You're putting words in her mouth. She has not claimed that the Order was unconstitutional. She has not claimed that allowing the DoJ to do its normal work of providing representation t…

Jesus Christ. So, now you are putting a ridiculously great many words in my mouth, alleging I've made claims I did not, apparently for the sake of providing yourself a reason to talk ... a lot. You seem to just want to hear yourself speak throughout your comments here. I didn't ask anything of you at all, yet you somehow imagine I did. You make sweeping statements of what everyone agrees on—yet everyone most certainly does not agree on these things.

We have different opinions on some things related to expectation of behaviors in certain conditions.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#486

Post by eli_gottlieb »

jdp23 wrote: post #390
rayiner wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even low level federal officials have an independent duty not to violate peoples' constitutional rights. They can be held personally liable for violating clearly established constitutional law, and following administration policy is not a defense. Usually the "clearly established" part protects the low level folks, but here you could see CBP line agents being held personally liable for excluding green card holders. O…

Indeed - there are limits to the "only following orders" defense. rayiner, I'm curious what you think about Dershowitz' argument that she should have resigned? http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/the-administration/317...

Dershowitz needs to buy his soul back from Satan and stop supporting the Trump administration.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#487

Post by dethswatch »

celticninja wrote: post #432
MR4D wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ignoring whether I agree or not with the order, firing the AAG made sense. Here's why: #1 - The AG is THE person to defend the administration in court, and even argues personally on behalf of administrations in front of the Supreme Court. Her duty is to defend the Administration's position (even if she personally disagrees with it). As wikipedia puts it (abbreviated for space here): "The United States Attorney Genera…

I am not American, but I believe your first point to be incorrect. The AG is supposed to defend the constitution (including from the president). In her confirmation hearing in 2015, senator Jeff Sessions, who is to take her place asked her: "Do you think the attorney general has a responsibility to say no to the president if he asks for something that's improper...?" Ms Yates replied: "I believe the attorney general…

>to give their independent legal advice to the president.

In private, and when he tells you that you're to carry out his wishes- since you're serving at his pleasure, then you go and do your job or you resign.

If you picked a public fight with your boss in the middle of the scrum and then refused to do what he wanted when you were overruled- how long would you last?

Also- let's not forget that Office of Legal Council had already said that it's perfectly Constitutional and legal.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#488

Post by savagej »

rohshall wrote: post #135

Almost my whole adult life, I looked up to America. Whatever I know and my life's value system is mostly because of the books I read by American authors. I couldn't belive the news when I heard that Americans chose Trump. When did America become so stupid to vote in these people?

Why are you so stupid as to think America will not defend its borders? Why are you so stupid as to not realize America is modeled on individual freedom, which is incompatible with Sharia Jihadis?

Defense of individual freedom and liberty (i.e. preventing the creation a police state and ensuring gun rights) is more important than leftist feelings. There are some bad dudes to remove in the meantime.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#489

Post by savagej »

benchaney wrote: post #265
mordant wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He trailed the leading candidate by almost three million votes i.e., he won the popular vote, except for California .

Is California not part of the United States?

It will eventually rejoin the US. But for now it is politically vastly different. The EC served its purpose in containing CA.

Re: Trump Fires Acting Attorney General

#490

Post by savagej »

sctb wrote: post #456
savagej wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you so stupid as to think America will not defend its borders? Why are you so stupid as to not realize America is modeled on individual freedom, which is incompatible with Sharia Jihadis? Defense of individual freedom and liberty (i.e. preventing the creation a police state and ensuring gun rights) is more important than leftist feelings. There are some bad dudes to remove in the meantime.

Please stop posting like this—personal attacks are not OK on Hacker News and we've already asked you to stop violating the guidelines. We have to ban accounts that won't post civilly and substantively.

Since you allow the parent to stay unflagged despite its identical language, I've reposted my comment.

Your move.

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