Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

dhs.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 152 posts

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#111

Post by smsm42 »

gizmo686 wrote: post #46
jquery wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congress has given the Executive broad powers to control immigration from countries. Please explain how a coup d'etat is happening. Obama bombed many of these countries and killed citizens of them, but I don't remember that being a scandal.

>but I don't remember that being a scandal. I do remember that being a scandal. To your main point, a story has been going around that a court has put a stay on the executive order. If true, this would mean that enforcing the order is currently illegal; and doing so could be called a "coup" by the executive branch (although I don't think this technically qualifies as a coup). Having said that, my understanding is tha…

> a story has been going around that a court has put a stay on the executive order.

That story is false (at least as far as I know). The stay was put on one detail of the implementation of the order, not the whole order - namely, on deporting green card holders that has already arrived in US airports.

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darweesh_v._Trump

> Having said that, my understanding is that the referenced court case only applies to the specific individuals who sued

ACLU is seeking class action status, but in the meantime if several judges agreed that the stay is warranted I imagine it would be not hard for any person (with access to law assistance etc. of course) to be able to obtain similar order.

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#112

Post by skuhn »

kyledrake wrote: post #107
skuhn wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting that they finally gave a scope to the people impacted. 3200 people doesn't seem like chump change to me. And I guess deporting people is the most enhanced security measure of them all. If we could deport everyone that lives in the US, I bet security would be pretty tight.

up to 3200 per day .

Only people this one day will get these "enhanced security measures" though, I guess. Since they won't let any of these people board flights from now on, their experiences will be differently enhanced tomorrow.

Regardless of how many people are actually turned away or detained in the airports or elsewhere, every single person with citizenship of one of these countries and a valid green card or visa is impacted (hundreds of thousands of people). Those still in the US are prisoners here now. They can't risk leaving the country for any reason.

Even if this executive order expires in 90 days and things go back to normal (which I doubt), they will still be afraid. The rule of law has been weakened.

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#113

Post by cmurf »

douche wrote: post #52
matthewmacleod wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's not that interesting. Context obviously matters, and I am baffled that so many people are pretending not to understand that.

What the hell is this context that you speak of? Defending the country's borders? Defending native industry? Preventing immigration from groups statistically likely to commit terrorist acts?

Sending Jews on boats back to Germany because they might not be refugees but Nazis looking to infiltrate the mainland?

Scared little bunny rabbits. Go scurry and hide rather than demand the rest of the world live in fear with you.

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#114

Post by bnolsen »

My niece and my aunt are coming to visit in a few days and there seems to be no issues. A lot of noise over stalling a few countries with serious terrorist and isis presence. Its going to be a few tough years as the media openly has the knives out and will do anything to bash the president.

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#116

Post by smsm42 »

solipsism wrote: post #82
aerovistae wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you point me to the sentence that says they're ignoring the court order? I think the intended interpretation of this seems pretty clear, maybe it's just me, but they seem to be saying "We will continue to enforce executive order minus any vetoes or alterations issued by courts." As you would expect them to.

Can you point me to the sentence that says they're ignoring the court order? Yes, the first one. The Department of Homeland Security will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders... The whole thing is self-contradictory. They cannot enforce all the executive orders while complying with all judicial orders. Your reading of it is one reading, don't pretend like it's the only reasonable reading. In…

> They cannot enforce all the executive orders while complying with all judicial orders

Of course they can. They will enforce all the orders, except for the parts which are specifically prohibited (or otherwise instructed) by court orders. Exactly how it always happened before.

> does not say they will comply with all judicial orders

Of course not. They don't have to comply with all of the orders, just with those that relate to something they are doing. See, I can do it too. The point is that this release doesn't say anything but "we'll continue doing what we should be doing in accordance with the law" and all panic about it is completely self-generated, as so far we haven't seen even single case of non-compliance (actually, people are not only not being deported but are being released: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/queens/iraqi-man-free-de...). Of course, whatever floats you boat...

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#117

Post by Buge »

bnolsen wrote: post #114

My niece and my aunt are coming to visit in a few days and there seems to be no issues. A lot of noise over stalling a few countries with serious terrorist and isis presence. Its going to be a few tough years as the media openly has the knives out and will do anything to bash the president.

Were your niece and aunt born in one of the 7 countries in the ban (Iran, Iraq, Syria, Sudan, Libya, Yemen, Somalia)? If not, then their situation is irrelevant.

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#118

Post by sago »

colechristensen wrote: post #103
sago wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First I acknowledge I don't know what I'm talking about. But. It seems to me the last and the first paragraph are saying different things. How can DHS be implementing ALL of the executive action, when part of it has been stayed by the court? Assuming this statement is, as it says, a response to the litigation (i.e. the challenge which led the court to stay part of the executive action), I don't see how you can read t…

The stay was effective only for those (essentially) who had already begun travelling to the US when the executive order was signed. So they can't deport the people they detained in the airports. This isn't anything but a minor detail and it's reasonable for the DHS to consider itself complying with the court order and implementing all of the executive action. It's just a minor difference in the people effected.

I suspect this is the angle they are going for. And, as I said, I think it unwise to read stuff into words, when actions are what counts.

Just FWIW, from what I can interpret, the ruling is broader than just the people currently 'on the ground' - they were the petitioners, but the judgement was not limited to them, but to:

"individuals with refugee applications approved by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services as part of the U.S. Refugee Admissions Program, holders of valid immigrant and non-immigrant visas, and other individuals from Iraq, Syria, Iran, Sudan, Libya, Somalia, and Yemen legally authorized to enter the United States."

There's no indication that the stay is limited to the petitioners or current detainees. I assume it would prevent deportation of anyone with legal grounds to be here, who arrive tomorrow, or any time until the full case is heard.

So we'll have to see if anyone is deported. Or if DHS get their act together and stop people boarding.

Re: DHS will continue to enforce all of President Trump’s Executive Orders

#119

Post by random_upvoter »

Tulip68 wrote: post #22

This is not hyperbole: if this statement is accurate, a coup d'etat is in progress in which our illegitimate "President" is overriding the authority of the judicial branch and it is time for every American who still believes in our constitution and our fundamental values of equality, diversity and multiculturalism take a stand and along with every congressman, every law enforcement officer, reporter, corporation, etc…

I'm sorry but this is exactly hyperbole. In a democracy you have elections, and the person who wins the election is invested with certain powers for a limited amount of time. If you want to undermine the whole game just because Trump is unpalatable to you, proceed at your own risk. You may set in motion a self-fulfilling catastrophe much worse than the worst Trump could ever do. At the very least keep in mind that roughly half of the country wanted Trump for president. Have you considered how they might feel about deposing the person they voted for?
Post reply on HN