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Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

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Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#161

Post by WalterBright »

czep wrote: post #60
lend000 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You will always need the job more than Comcast will need you Where is the evidence for this? This is by no means an obvious claim. No one in the world needs "the job," even though most people need "a job." Do companies exist that are more moral/popular/friendly than others? Of course. And some of them are successful in part because people want them to succeed due to their aforementioned characteristics. That is fre…

>> > You will always need the job more than Comcast will need you > Where is the evidence for this? It does not require a great deal of imagination to understand that a large corporation and single prospective employee are not equal parties. If you fail to get a job, you will starve. If Comcast fails to hire you, they most clearly will not face an existential crisis. This is most certainly not a free market at work.…

> If you fail to get a job, you will starve.

That sort of implies that you were born to have that job, and Comcast was formed to provide you with that job.

Furthermore, any job that pays more than minimum wage implies there was negotiating going on and either party was willing to walk away.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#162

Post by WalterBright »

czep wrote: post #79
pliny wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It does not require a great deal of imagination to understand that a large corporation and single prospective employee are not equal parties. If you fail to get a job, you will starve. If Comcast fails to hire you, they most clearly will not face an existential crisis. Is Comcast the only company hiring people? If you don't get a job with Comcast you get a job with a different company. That is a market, many sellers…

Comcast is simply the example here. Yes you can look for another employer, but if they are doing the same thing -- requiring disclosure of salary history -- then in aggregate this will put more negotiating power in the hands of employers and thus reduce workers' incomes.

On the other hand, if your salary history shows you were paid well, the company will realize you are likely more competent than your job history otherwise suggests, and that they should offer you more.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#163

Post by WalterBright »

quickben wrote: post #116
pliny wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It does not require a great deal of imagination to understand that a large corporation and single prospective employee are not equal parties. If you fail to get a job, you will starve. If Comcast fails to hire you, they most clearly will not face an existential crisis. Is Comcast the only company hiring people? If you don't get a job with Comcast you get a job with a different company. That is a market, many sellers…

You are missing the point. Companies are offering jobs and thus in a position of power.

I've been on both sides - employer and employee. As an employer, the notion I had all this power over people is pretty eyebrow raising. If an employee didn't like something, he was out the door and there was nothing I could do about it. As an employee, if I didn't like something, I was out the door and there was nothing the employer could do about it.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#164

Post by WalterBright »

czep wrote: post #78
krapp wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing about a free market requires all power dynamics to be equal among all participants - that would be impossible without regulation, and a free market must by definition be free of any regulatory influence.

No, a free market is not defined by absence of regulation! Even fervent laissez-faire economists admit the necessity of appropriate regulations: contract enforcement rules, avoidance of monopolies, a system of law and order for handling disputes, etc. A free market is defined as an exchange where both sides have access to the same information.

> A free market is defined as an exchange where both sides have access to the same information.

I disagree - it's where neither party is using force or fraud.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#165

Post by jacquesc »

I support this, but I also think employers should be banned from requiring a credit check for employment. There are regulations on discriminating on race, gender, etc. The one missing piece is discriminating against the poor (which indirectly tie back to race, gender). It's still amazing to me that this is a practice that's still allowed for a society that purports to value social mobility.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#166

Post by jacquesc »

criveros wrote: post #153

I added 10k to my salary last time I was asked.

You may have stumbled upon a solution here. Make it legal to ask the question, but also make it legal to lie about the answer (including doctoring paystubs, etc). Seems like a uniquely libertarian solution.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#167

Post by danieltillett »

wutbrodo wrote: post #93
gambiting wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I personally know of a case where someone got rejected because they asked for too much compared to his previous salary, even though the person who got hired was offered more money(but it was a smaller increase percentage wise over his previous job). Basically guy was brilliant in the interview, engineering team said they want him, but HR rejected him because he said he wants 80k, while he was making 60k previously(he…

Wow, that HR sounds utterly incompetent.

That HR sounds like all HR departments I have ever had anything to do with.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#168

Post by jacquesc »

ennuihenry wrote: post #158
legodt wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try hitting the "web" button under the link and navigating in through google. If that doesn't work, I made you a pastebin of the raw text: http://pastebin.com/kS5QPEiF

It seems like the WSJ has closed the HTTP Google referer paywall loophole. I've tried a couple of browsers/OSes over the last week and I can't view any articles. TY though for the pastebin.

The trick is opening the search result link in an incognito window (if you're using Chrome). It's a pretty nutty loophole, surprised it's gone on as long as it has.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#169

Post by danieltillett »

Every regulatory hurdle to hiring decreases the propensity of businesses to hire marginal candidates. The easier you make it to hire and fire people the more marginal candidates will be given the chance. There is no free-lunch here.

Re: Philadelphia Poised to Ban Employers from Asking Hires About Salary History

#170

Post by [deleted] »

jacquesc wrote: post #168
ennuihenry wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like the WSJ has closed the HTTP Google referer paywall loophole. I've tried a couple of browsers/OSes over the last week and I can't view any articles. TY though for the pastebin.

The trick is opening the search result link in an incognito window (if you're using Chrome). It's a pretty nutty loophole, surprised it's gone on as long as it has.

[deleted]
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